Rate and Discuss 6.13: The Wedding of River Song

[SiHart]

It's the day of the Doctor's death. The day of River Song's wedding and probably a whole lot more besides, if this season ends the way it began.

But what did you think of it?

[Alex]

Loved it, loved it, loved it!!! A crazy rollicking adventure which looked utterly beautiful, was jam packed with lots of gorgeous moments and brilliant lines, yet it still found the time to have a very emotional impact as well. The Silence were more disturbing than ever (and are easily my favourite new series monster), but there were so many other fantastic moments too, including the chattering skulls, the whole look of the merged reality, and Amy and Rory just being outstanding yet again.

If I wanted too I could probably pick holes in it a little, but I don't! It was utterly sublime, and even though I don't believe in giving 10/10 ratings and never have done so before as surely nothing could be perfect, I have here because I just thought this wonderful.

10/10, then. Moffat, you've only gone and written the best Who episode ever there.

Oh, and given Amy's comments on her baby, and killing Madam Kovarian as a response to that, yet being deeply affected by it, well, I'm more than happy with the way all the baby stuff was resolved too. So yay!

[Rob McCow]

Absolutely loved it! Wonderful tribute to Nick Courtney. Lots of questions answered, including 'what are they spending all the money on this year?'

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[SiHart]

Oh, that was a wonderful little moment with the Brig's death. Just a little moment, but it brought a tear to my eye. A beautiful moment...

...In an insane episode. Somehow it all worked! It shouldn't have done, but somehow it all did. I'm a bit wowed, trying to take it all in at the moment.

Somehow I don't think it's going to be universally loved, but there we go. All I can say I really did love it tonight.

[Simon R]

I guessed what the question was!

[Nyder]

Yes I'm trying to absorb it all too - I MUST watch it again very soon Wonderful, wonderful, wonderful! Oh those skulls - that's even going to give ME nightmares. So... the teselecta Doctor...... is that why Matt Smith was wearing a wig? That was a wig wasn't it? It was long but it wasn't flowing. Must. Eat. I've a terrible craving for scones....

[SiHart]

I guessed what the question was!

I didn't. Should have done, it really was obvious!

[Si Hunt]

Oh, he's good isn't he? Really good.

I think what's been bothering me this year, what's been a little enjoyment block in mind, is the fact that they must have cheated. They said, no bragged, that they'd killed the Doctor, and said they hadn't lied, and yet we saw him burned. The fact that, like before, it would all turn out to be a cop-out, or even worse, that it wouldn't be a cop-out and we'd have to accept a substitute/ganger/alternate reality Doctor as our new lead character, has been nagging away at me all year.

And it looked like they had! I even said the other day that the Doctor dying and then not doing would cause reality to split and that would be the springboard. And it felt like they'd cheated.

But then - oh that resolution. What gets me, what makes me so impressed, is that they did the Ganger episode and everyone since has been murmering that the shot Doctor would be a ganger. And then they did the episode with a robot disguised as a dead person and no-one - NO-ONE! - twigged that that would be how they got out of it.

Secrets in plain sight! Oh, he's good!

Although, actually, technically, DWM have been smugly trumpetting for the last six months that "one of our lead characters will die" and "The Doctor really is dead" and neither is true. So they did kind of cheat. But the resolution we got was so logical yet so surprising that it is, unbelivably, enough to let them off the hook.

Elsewhere it was actually a lovely action-packed episode, the clacking Skulls and the Silents in tanks were great imagery. Not sure the Ultimate Question "Doctor Who?" is as intriguing when you really think about it as it is exciting to hear the show's title said out-loud. After all, we do actually know who the Doctor is. As wonderful and magical and mysterious and charming as the Doctor is, we actually do know him by now. An early episode this year even took time to tell us how he aquired the TARDIS and left Gallifrey. Unless "Doctor Who?" means something else.

The nod to the Brigadier was nice but, I felt, a bit bungled as it was done so quick. I think the idea was that his death made the Doctor realise it was time to go Lake Silencia and face his fate... but I think we needed an extra 10 seconds or so for the news to sink in. It was edited so quickly I didn't get any emotional depth from it.

The season has, however, been clawed back from the brink. I think I will now re-watch the earlier episodes with more appreciation, now I know it ended so cleverly.

Si.

[Simon R]

Did all the people inside the fake . Doctor thing die when it got burned or did time change and that didn't happen? My only complaint is that yet again it was another fake reality story in one way or another.

[Dino]

I admit, I didn't see the Tessla get out coming. But when the Doctor was asked "Is there anything more we can do for you?" I did think "Well you could make the audience think that was the actual proper end to this conversation".

I can't vote as I can't get a grip on my feelings. I wasn't excited, but wasn't disappointed. There were some great elements in this episode.
Maybe this show just isn't for me anymore?

[Alex]

Unless "Doctor Who?" means something else.

It could well do. I mean it could relate to who he will become, and what role he plays in the fate of the galaxy - after it was made pretty clear that he had only delayed his future, and that he would have to face it one day. And there are other possibilities I'm sure.

The nod to the Brigadier was nice but, I felt, a bit bungled as it was done so quick. I think the idea was that his death made the Doctor realise it was time to go Lake Silencia and face his fate... but I think we needed an extra 10 seconds or so for the news to sink in. It was edited so quickly I didn't get any emotional depth from it.

Aw, I really loved that, and it personally did work for me. I may have even shed a few manly tears.

Did all the people inside the fake . Doctor thing die when it got burned or did time change and that didn't happen? My only complaint is that yet again it was another fake reality story in one way or another.

He mentioned that 'the ship' was only slightly singed, so I took that to mean the Teselecta, which presumably wouldn't burn up in the way a normal human body would do.

[Si Hunt]

It could well do. I mean it could relate to who he will become, and what role he plays in the fate of the galaxy - after it was made pretty clear that he had only delayed his future, and that he would have to face it one day. And there are other possibilities I'm sure.

Exactly - vague. This script writer could get out of the script equivilent of a pair of handcuffs, chains and a wooden box chucked into the sea with bricks attached. So he'll have to promise something a little more enticing than "Doctor Who?" to make me excited.

Si.

[Si Hunt]

Oh and what no Xmas Special Title?

Si.

[Alex]

Exactly - vague. This script writer could get out of the script equivilent of a pair of handcuffs, chains and a wooden box chucked into the sea with bricks attached. So he'll have to promise something a little more enticing than "Doctor Who?" to make me excited.

Si.

Aw, I think you're a being a bit harsh on Moffat here. With this episode I think he's proven (at least for me) how adept he is at planning out season / series arcs, and I'm convinced he knows what he's doing. Whether or not we'll like that is of course open to question, I've no idea what direction he's going to take us in now, but given how much I've loved his tenure so far, I've a lot of faith in him.

As for being excited, well of course again it's a very personal standpoint, but I've loved these last two seasons, and this most recent one is my favourite since the show returned, so I'm just excited by more adventures with the Doctor from the man, and those who he chooses to hire. Well, most of the latter, hopefully next year Gareth Roberts won't be given another episode to write!

[Si Hunt]

Just to say, I am excited by the future and I did enjoy this episode!

Si.

[Matthew T]

I didn't guess before, but as soon as we were shown the Tessla from Let's Kill Hitler in the opening recap, it clicked straight away that that was how they were going to get out of it!

I enjoyed this episode but was a bit baffled most of the way through. I still don't get who Madame Kovarian is, or why she wanted the doctor dead. What happened to all The Silence, did they die when time reset itself?

I loved the imagery of the skulls, that viking being eaten by the skulls will have given a few kids nightmares I'm sure!

[Andrew Curnow]

I'm terribly conflicted - I really enjoyed it at the time, but by about ten minutes later I felt a bit... cheated. We don't know anything more about how the baby got to the spacesuit in 1969 or got to Leadworth or why Kovarian bothered with all that when the suit apparently shot the Doctor, occupant notwithstanding... And I can't but assume that this "Doctor Who?" thing is going to be stretched out now until the 50th anniversary - that's a lot of build up, and it's hard to imagine a satisying resolution. I'm not sure "hidden in plain sight" bears much scrutiny either, it's not like we get the "Doctor Who?" gag all that often in the show itself do we?

So although there was a lot to love about the episode itself, it's been very unsatisfying as the finale to an infuriating season. Zel guessed the Teselecta 'get out' the instant the clip from LKH was shown in the 'Previously' and we both guessed 'Doctor Who?' And... was there a reason why the TeselctaDoctor didn't tell River the truth earlier (by the lakeside might have been a good place)?

But, as I say, bizarrely I enjoyed it while it was on. And the Brigadier moment, not to mention the wedding itself, were very touching. Not to mention, Smith was as superb as ever - when he told River she was embarrassing him, it really hit home.

[Matthew T]

Oh and I love the fact that The Doctor has decided that he's got too big, and wants to go back to being in the shadows...

[Alex]

I didn't guess before, but as soon as we were shown the Tessla from Let's Kill Hitler in the opening recap, it clicked straight away that that was how they were going to get out of it!

I enjoyed this episode but was a bit baffled most of the way through. I still don't get who Madame Kovarian is, or why she wanted the doctor dead. What happened to all The Silence, did they die when time reset itself?

It would have gone back to humans killing The Silence on sight, as before time merged / stopped. As for the other questions, Moffat's playing the long game here I believe - as Dorium Maldovar stated, The Doctor's only delayed his future, and can't escape it forever.

Oh and I love the fact that The Doctor has decided that he's got too big, and wants to go back to being in the shadows...

Absolutely. I've really enjoyed how RTD (and Moffat, to a lesser extent) explored the idea of the Doctor becoming a Universe's saviour, but also it's most feared warrior, but I think that's been done now and I love the idea that Moffat's (hopefully) taking us in a new direction now.

[Zbigniev Hamson]

It was fun, but still there's loads of things not explained yet, despite the claims in the Radio Times that they would be. So that's a bit annoying. And really, it just felt a hell of a lot like the end to last year's season. All reality breaks down (again) and the Doctor has to sacrifice his life to reset the universe (again), but then gets out of it all at the last second (again).

[Zbigniev Hamson]

Oh and why did they have to get married? No real reason that I can see.

[Andrew Curnow]

I think that was so that River would... obey him? Erm...

[Zbigniev Hamson]

The Doctor must also be an ordained minister as well as all his other qualifications. Probably a Venusian minister, where they are allowed to perform their own marriage services in the absence of a suitable Thraskin.

[Rob McCow]

Oh! Sam Kisgart! SaaaaaM KisGart! Of course!

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[Alex]

Oh and why did they have to get married? No real reason that I can see.

He knew he had to convince River to let him go back to the proper reality, but also not let Amy and Rory know what was his plan was, as it was important that they thought he was dead (at least at the time, when the Silence were also present).

Plus it's fun! Stop being such a moody old sod and just enjoy a show which delights in being quirky and unusual but also incredibly joyful!