Tube Strike Menace - Londoners Flee!

[Rob McCow]

Good luck getting home all you London based PS'ers. The Tubes are on strike and we're all going to pay for Metronet's incompetence!

Although I only take mainline trains. Fingers crossed!

[Darren]

They really are cretins at the RMT. They have said they haven't got the assurances they want, but won't tell TfL what they are.

I'm back at work tomorrow, but as I'm on "lates" all week, I might have an easier time. I've got two alternate routes planned.

The Jubilee, Northern and Piccadilly lines will be running because they are maintained by Tube Lines.

[Paul Monk]

I only use mainline trains so should be ok. I say sack the lot of them and get robots in to do the job. Or trained monkeys. They'd be better.

[Rob McCow]

The DLR was still running. FACT.

[Jonno]

I was very lucky tonight as they allowed me to leave a bit earlier and I took the Northern Line with no problem to Moorgate, then walked to Liverpool St (only 5 mins or so) and got on the mainline train home, even managing a seat! I fear it will not be so easy for the next three days though, and am planning to get up earlier in the morning to take the bus to London Bridge, which is 10 mins walk away. It's a long old ride which I've already done a few times when there's been severe delays on the Victoria Line, but I fear it will be busier than normal - another reason I'm going to leave early.

All part of the joy of commuting in London I suppose!

[Andrew Curnow]

I ride a bike. And don't live in London. I just wanted to post to say that Rob's thread title made me chuckle!

[Captain Tancredi]

My bus home was 45 minutes late tonight due to a burst water main in Leeds city centre bringing everything to a standstill- the same bus was about 50 minutes late on Friday because of an accident. Still, a few Southerners have to walk a bit and it's the end of the world.

[Jonno]

Well, I certainly wouldn't want to walk from home to work - about 8 miles I think!

[duncan]

I only use mainline trains so should be ok. I say sack the lot of them and get robots in to do the job. Or trained monkeys. They'd be better.

As a tube worker, I find that remark quite offensive.

I work hard and have never been on strike in my life. I will also be working over the strike to try my best to help customers reach their destinations as quickly as possible.

Please don't tar everyone with the same brush!

[Alex]

My bus home was 45 minutes late tonight due to a burst water main in Leeds city centre bringing everything to a standstill- the same bus was about 50 minutes late on Friday because of an accident. Still, a few Southerners have to walk a bit and it's the end of the world.

Erm, have you not ever noticed how big London is Ian? I know a fair few people who travel from South East London to North East London each day and without the tubes it's a nightmare. On strike days you normally have to wait a fair old while for a bus (and then it might turn up full), and walking would literally take hours.

I'm a bit annoyed by the strike because I was thinking of going up to London this week, but there's no way I can do it whilst still using a crutch, unable to walk long distances without being in a fair bit of pain, and having no idea whether or not I'd get a seat on the bus or not (well, y'know how London can be sometimes).

I think the tube staff do do a good job, and I've seen them having to put up with a lot of unreasonable customers, and maintenance wise it's a job I'd hate to do - but I do think they definitely strike unfairly sometimes, with the knowledge that if they do it can cost the city millions if not billions in lost time. Plus it's hardly a good advert for tourism either...

[Captain Tancredi]

Erm, have you not ever noticed how big London is Ian? I know a fair few people who travel from South East London to North East London each day and without the tubes it's a nightmare. On strike days you normally have to wait a fair old while for a bus (and then it might turn up full), and walking would literally take hours.

Er, yes, I noticed that while walking from Queensway to Kings Cross last year- took about two hours (including a wander around Kensington Gardens) and I saw all sorts of interesting things I would never have seen otherwise. Part of the problem is that when people commute, they get a certain route stuck in their heads and can't think of any other way of doing it. It's just a case of being imaginative and using what resources are available- as happened when we had a bus strike in Leeds last December which left me with no obvious way of travelling the 12 miles into work.

[Paul Monk]

As a tube worker, I find that remark quite offensive.

I work hard and have never been on strike in my life. I will also be working over the strike to try my best to help customers reach their destinations as quickly as possible.

Please don't tar everyone with the same brush!

Oops sorry Duncan. It was a bit of a flippant remark made without thinking. Its just that the greed (and thats what these strikes are about) of some of the workers on the tube makes me very angry. No-one should be allowed to effectively hold a city to ransom and get away with it.

[Ralph]

Oops sorry Duncan. It was a bit of a flippant remark made without thinking. Its just that the greed (and thats what these strikes are about) of some of the workers on the tube makes me very angry. No-one should be allowed to effectively hold a city to ransom and get away with it.

I understand your anger Paul - I totally agree that it's out of order that the general public get such shoddy treatment.

[Rob McCow]

Do the Unions expect to gain the sympathy of the public through striking?

Metronet messed up by spending money refurbishing stations when they should have concentrated on minimising delays and updating the rolling stock. Subsequently, they were fined to buggery for their service. They should have been sitting on a goldmine, running those Tube lines, but instead they were incompetent enough to muck it up.

This situation shouldn't have ever been close to happening, but somehow they've managed it.

[Thasc]

I hope everybody affected by this strike gets home ok, fingers crossed

[duncan]

These strikes are about jobs and pensions not more money. A worker going on strike is not doing anything illegal, so saying they shouldn't be allowed to strike is nonsense. Yes, the travelling public are disrupted and I dont necessarily agree with that.

[Captain Tancredi]

We live in a country which has a free labour market, so if you don't like the terms and conditions, salary, pensions, etc. that your current employer is offering (and I'm making a generalisation here not responding directly to Duncan), there's nothing to stop you looking for a more congenial job somewhere else. Similarly, if your pension is threatened, there's nothing to stop you taking out a private one in your own right.

A strike seems to me to be a legally-sanctioned way of breaking your contract of employment with no consequences except for loss of pay. These days the standard management response to strikes in most industries is however to weather them out, in the knowledge that the longer they go on, the more public support the strikers stand to lose, and that the union members will start to lose their enthusiasm when they start having to get by on half their weekly wage because they were on strike for half their contracted hours. One of the reasons the Leeds bus strike died without a whimper was because the drivers found fairly quickly that they had no public support to begin with, striking as they were in the run-up to Christmas- indeed it was reported that market traders and cafes in Leeds were refusing to serve bus drivers in uniform because of the trade they'd lost.

[Jonno]

Well, I got up and left the house half an hour earlier today, took the local bus to London Bridge and approx. two and a half hours later got to work! They were sympathetic and took it all in their stride, which I guessed they would, but you do still feel a bit guilty! I was lucky to get on a full train tonight which made for a much quicker journey back, but I was lucky as many couldn't get it on it even a good five minutes before it was due to depart!

I decided when I got to work that I couldn't be doing with this for three consecutive days, so as I've still got loads of holiday left to take this year and the weather forecast looks very good currently, I'm taking the next two days off on an impromptu holiday - again, work were fine about this. I'd rather be at home getting stuff done, and being out in the sunshine, than spending hours commuting.

[duncan]

We live in a country which has a free labour market, so if you don't like the terms and conditions, salary, pensions, etc. that your current employer is offering (and I'm making a generalisation here not responding directly to Duncan), there's nothing to stop you looking for a more congenial job somewhere else. Similarly, if your pension is threatened, there's nothing to stop you taking out a private one in your own right.

A strike seems to me to be a legally-sanctioned way of breaking your contract of employment with no consequences except for loss of pay. These days the standard management response to strikes in most industries is however to weather them out, in the knowledge that the longer they go on, the more public support the strikers stand to lose, and that the union members will start to lose their enthusiasm when they start having to get by on half their weekly wage because they were on strike for half their contracted hours. One of the reasons the Leeds bus strike died without a whimper was because the drivers found fairly quickly that they had no public support to begin with, striking as they were in the run-up to Christmas- indeed it was reported that market traders and cafes in Leeds were refusing to serve bus drivers in uniform because of the trade they'd lost.

Lets get this straight. The strike is NOT about better terms and conditions but to KEEP the existing ones. Infact, it's a strike to fight to keep their jobs full stop.

It is not station or train staff that are on strike, it's the maintenanace staff. Metronet looked after two thirds of the Underground and they checked that the trains and track are safe to use each night. Without the trains and track being declared safe, the service cannot run. Underground staff, like myself, turned up for work as usual which is why there was a service on three of the lines today.

When the labour government imposed the PPP contracts, they were warned it wouldnt work, and LUL gave assurances that jobs and pensions would be safe in case anything went belly up when they transferred all their maintenance staff to the new private firms (Metronet and Tube Lines). Now it has gone pear shpaed, those assurances have gone. These people want to work, but they want the same terms and conditions they had before. Some have paid into the pension fund for many years and have a right to be concerned about their nest egg. They shouldn't have to just walk away and take out a private pension.

So, please remember when you can't get your tube tomorrow, that it isnt the station staff that are at fault. I'm staff and I was affected as much as you guys too.

[Richard Beeby]

A worker going on strike is not doing anything illegal, so saying they shouldn't be allowed to strike is nonsense.

And there lies the fantastic argument to change the law so that there is no immunity to striking workers.

There is no right to strike in British common law, but for most of the last century that did not matter simply because of some case law from 1906 which gave immunity to striking workers

Whilst on strike you are actually in breach of your terms and conditions of employment and employers should be able to take action against those that are in breach of contract - but they can't!

Judges can grant injunctions to prevent strikes - even for those professions unlike police and the recent prison workers - that have a perceived right to strike. Also, employers can sue unions if the strike is deemd to be "illegal" and I feel the public should also be allowed to sue unions for the disruption they cause. Employers should make more of this so that unions cannot hold the public to ransom with public services.

Equally, the loss of jobs and job security is always a shame and will cause untold insecurity and stress for those affected, but the legal route should be followed as we have a whole host of acts and legislation that protects workers. (Well, enough to keep me in a job at any rate!)