The Peter Cushing Appreciation Thread

[DrWho2150]

First post is a thread for those who wish to appreciate the Peter Cushing Dr Who Dalek films of the late 1960s. The Unsung Doctor gets his day.

Only positive comments please.

[WhiteCrow]

Well we've talked about these films before.

I like them, they bring the Daleks on screen with a bit of dazzle and spectacle, and in under 90 minutes. My son loves them, okay they are dumbed down and shorter, but on the whole what's been cut never feels terribly important.

Indeed looking at them now, they feel in tempo and pace very like the new RTD Who (oh I like that phrase), with less of the padding often used in the series to pad out 3 episodes of story into 4, or in the case of many a Jon Pertwee story, 3 episodes of story into 6!

[Rob McCow]

I loved his slightly more bumbling way of playing the Doctor. My favourite scene is where the Doctor and Tom Campbell are looking at a map. He traces a line from London to Bedfordshire (clearly about 50 miles) and murmurs 'Hmm! Yes, 3 miles!' - they are then immediately attacked by the Robomen, who they repel before the Doctor picks himself up and says in his unshaken belief 'Hmm! Yes! 3 miles!'

And who else could deliver a line like 'Stop the countdown! The bomb will destroy the planet!' in such a wonderfully iconic way?

[DrWho2150]

Thanks for taking part my friends. I have no doubt these films have been discussed at Planet Skaro in the past but I am completely new to these parts and would not be aware of it.

I really like Cushing's Doctor and was amazed at the reinterpretation of both the TV serials (which indeed run much faster and thus easier to watch in one go!) and Susan. A shame they did not make a third film.

I also like how at this early point in the history of Who the Doctor was made human, as the series had yet to offcially make the Doctor from the TV an alien. Some fans do not appreciate this and use this argument to denounce Cushing.

And the Daleks look fantastic here.

[Dave Tudor]

Only positive comments please.

Welcome to the board, DrWho, but, just a thought... you're not really going to get a good, well-balanced discussion if all you want us to do is say how great the films are, when, deep down, we all know that they're not. Yes, I do really like them, as an interesting take on 'Doctor Who', and as a fun and colourful slice of 60's British cinema, but they're not without their faults.

Both films are very rushed, for a start - although Mike does make a good point that they manage to sustain essentially the same storyline as their original TV counterparts without much padding; they have an odd mix of performances, ranging from the overly comedic (e.g. Roy Castle and Bernard Cribbins) to the very stilted and stagey acting of, say, the Thals in the first film (oh, and I know they were making the most of the technicolour, but Alydon and chums really do look hilariously bad!). And I can never make up my mind as to whether Roberta Tovey is surprisingly good for such a young actress or just plain irritating.

As for Peter Cushing's Doctor, well he's an actor I admire enormously, and it's testament to his chamelonic skill as a performer that he's barely recognisable as the same man who played Baron Frankenstein or Moff Tarkin. The friendly, bumbling, absent-minded English scientist, Dr. Who, is a novel approach to the character, and it works well as a one-off (or two-off, as the case may be!), but I'm glad this idea was never attempted in the series. The main criticism, though, is that he's often pushed into the background, in favour of, firstly, Ian and then, Tom - sometimes even Susan gets more action. OK, so this was the approach adopted with Hartnell on television, but Cushing was a younger actor, more capable of coping with the strains of film production and it's just a shame they didn't make the most of this.

Of the two, I'd say the faster-moving, more action-packed 'Daleks: Invasion Earth 2150 AD' is the better film, but then the original is among my favourite 'Who' stories, and it certainly scores above the 1964 serial in its marvellous design, especially that wonderful Dalek saucer. I do sometimes think it's a shame that they didn't manage to produce one final cinema outing for Cushing's Doctor, maybe even in a wholly orginal script, but on the whole, I think it better that our hero's big screen adventures were confined to these two fun-but-flawed movies.

[Wayne]

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[DrWho2150]

There is no 'deep down we all now they are not.' I clearly like them or would not have put myself at such exposure to make my first post about them. Things may be different here but I have found that most sites become war zones when negative comments are allowed for certain subjects. Balance in such matters is a joke. So please respect a new comer to your site and not start something here. Can we not have a place for fans of the films to talk without worrying about negativity?

[Dave Tudor]

I'm not starting something, and I'm sure you'll appreciate that I've managed to post a balanced criticism of the films with plenty of positive and (for want of a better word) negative comments. I just feel that to evaluate anything properly, whether it's film, television or music, you have to acknowledge its bad points as well as its good.

I don't know what your experiences have been elsewhere, but I'm sure you'll find Planet Skaro a very friendly place where balanced arguments are allowed without them degenerating into 'war zones'.

Well, most of the time, anyway!

[DrWho2150]

Thank you for your opinion but this matter is closed.

I would like to know what the fans thought of de-aging poor Susan. And the thrill of seeing the Black Dalek! No doubt new series fans see a Black Dalek now days and think of Sec!

[Dave Tudor]

Thank you for your opinion but this matter is closed.

OK.

[SiHart]

Hang on, if you give us a chance here, you'll find PS is a place where you'll always get a balanced and well argued group of views. To come in and say you only want positive views is going to stiffle discussion of them. Perhaps you should give it a chance before declaring "the matter is closed".

Thanks,

Si xx

[DrWho2150]

I am trying to avoid confrontation which I would think a Moderator would also want. If your friend can accept this then so should you. This is a clearly marked Apprecation thread. Please respect that . Now moving on....

[SiHart]

I am always in favour of needless confrontation, but I think that to demand that only people post positive things is not necessarily always good. A little healthy debate always seems to work here, as I'm sure you'll find when you read around some of the more controversial things we've discussed on PS.

Si xx

[Logo Polish]

I also like how at this early point in the history of Who the Doctor was made human, as the series had yet to offcially make the Doctor from the TV an alien. Some fans do not appreciate this and use this argument to denounce Cushing.

Susan was born in another time, and on another world, according to the first episode, and as she's supposed to be his granddaughter, that's official enough for me.

It would be silly to "denounce" Cushing, or the films, on those grounds though, as it was most likely a case of the film makers coming up with a quickly explained background of their own, the TV series having left it mysterious.

[DrWho2150]

Please stop posting on this topic. My intent is to facilitate an open posting enviroment discussion for fans of the films. Now unless you have something to say on topic about Susan or the Black Dalek...please go.

[DrWho2150]

Susan was born in another time, and on another world, according to the first episode, and as she's supposed to be his granddaughter, that's official enough for me.

It would be silly to "denounce" Cushing, or the films, on those grounds though, as it was most likely a case of the film makers coming up with a quickly explained background of their own, the TV series having left it mysterious.

Actually the quote from Susan is what I agree with. Her comments were in fact edited from the final cut of the first episode. But still, her comments are vague enough to cover being human from a far off future time.

[Dave Tudor]

I am trying to avoid confrontation which I would think a Moderator would also want.

But for people to post balanced arguments and to have those thoughts and opinions dismissed is surely asking for confrontation?

If your friend can accept this then so should you.

Hmmm....

This is a clearly marked Apprecation thread.

Yes, but 'appreciation' doesn't necessarily mean just saying how good things are.

Please respect that .

Oh, I can't be bothered anymore.

[DrWho2150]

Good. I will not be tolerating the usual kind of fan division that permeates every Doctor Who site I have been to. I never knew how divided fandom was over the respective eras of the TV series and the spinoffs. until I came online.

You say your site is different but yet you want me to compromise my post idea to better meet your own perception of what makes a good thread,

sorry I can't oblige you.

[SiHart]

Please stop posting on this topic. My intent is to facilitate an open posting enviroment discussion for fans of the films. Now unless you have something to say on topic about Susan or the Black Dalek...please go.

Excuse me.

Perhaps you could have a look round PS and get a feel for the place before posting things like this. This is not a place for you or anyone else, other than the moderation team (in certain circumtsances) to tell how they can or cannot post on PS. Please respect that.

Thanks.

Si xx

[Logo Polish]

Actually the quote from Susan is what I agree with. Her comments were in fact edited from the final cut of the first episode. But still, her comments are vague enough to cover being human from a far off future time.

What final cut? Seeing as they're included in the broadcast version? And there's also her description of her home planet in The Sensorites, which predates the first film by about a year. You could, I suppose, infer it's a human colony from the future, but as that's never explicitly suggested to be the case, and the Doctor talks as if his civilisation is distinct from Ian and Barbara's, I think the implication is of non-human origin.

Although, as I say, I don't think any of that is germane to rating the films.

[Stephen Morgan]

Ditto what Dave and Si have already said.

Planet Skaro is a great place to post, we often have differing views.
Surely your original post alone prompts "confrontation" by asking only for positive comments. It has been pointed out to you, quite nicely too, that to get a balanced view you have to accept criticism, you seem incapable or unwilling to understand that, asking people to "move on" or "matter closed", again prompting confrontation. The world would be a very boring place indeed if we all had the same views, likes and dislikes

[DrWho2150]

Please close this thread.

[Wayne]

It's all there in the user name, really. Milky Tears knows what i'm talking about.

[Jeff]

Good. I will not be tolerating the usual kind of fan division that permeates every Doctor Who site I have been to. I never knew how divided fandom was over the respective eras of the TV series and the spinoffs. until I came online.

You say your site is different but yet you want me to compromise my post idea to better meet your own perception of what makes a good thread,

sorry I can't oblige you.

Perhaps other sites you have been to have a posting style where you "own" the threads you start... That is not how it works here. You don't tell people how to post on PS and you don't tell people where they can post. Likewise, you will find that in fairness, no one will tell you those things either.

Regarding the temperment here, what has been said is true. You will find that discussion on PS very, very rarely breaks down into a "warzone". That is because unlike other sites where everyone is pretty much strangers posting their opinions for people who don't really care, there are only a small number of posters here, and the vast majority of us have been here for years. I'd say the average is 3 or 4 years at least. Many know each other personally on a face to face basis. They meet up at regular intervals and enjoy friendship and comraderie. As we are all REAL friends here (some have engaged in long term intimate relationships), and are not strangers to one another, we just don't fight. Sure, you'll get debates with opposing opinions, but those opinions are treated with respect. The people who come here that cannot get along with others, who don't have respect, or who cause trouble becuase they can't handle other people having a different opinion than themselves quickly find themselves unwelcome and leave, or soon get banned from the site.

And by the way, having respect does not mean coming here on your first day and telling the rest of us what YOU are going to tolerate and put up with. If you want to be a part of a very unique internet community where you can make real friends that you will get to know over a matter of many years, then you are welcome to be here; that is why membership is open. But you don't come in and start laying down the law to us and being pushy and bossy, cause it just isn't going to happen. All of us who have been here for years are not going to change the way things have been for many years just to suit you. If you want to have a rewarding time here, you need to sit back a bit and go with the flow for a little while.. find out how things are done here and join in as one of us instead of thinking you can give us instructions that we will follow.

[Larry]

Good. I will not be tolerating the usual kind of fan division that permeates every Doctor Who site I have been to. I never knew how divided fandom was over the respective eras of the TV series and the spinoffs. until I came online.

You say your site is different but yet you want me to compromise my post idea to better meet your own perception of what makes a good thread,

sorry I can't oblige you.

sorry mate but this and every other forum is all about opinion your attitude of every one must agree with your views or they should sod off are not wanted on P.S or for that matter any other Doctor Who forums.