2:12 Fragments

[Larry]

one of the best of the series loved all the flash backs of how they all ended up in Torchwood, especialy Jack's and those two very sexy Torchwood babes and hooray for UNIT..

[stuartdg]

Two strong Chibnall episodes in a row

Very good stuff and the finale looks unlikely to disappoint either

[WhiteCrow]

hooray for UNIT..

They seem to have turned into fascists since the Brig left though. No wonder the United Nations withdrew their backing.

[Dirk Gently]

An excellent episode. Nice to see some history...although I'm not entirely sure Jack's will stand up to too much scrutiny with other story lines in the past. Also, Ianto seemed to be the same before he joined Torchwood as he is now & yet last year he was different. Surely he should have been the same in the past as he was last year?
Tosh was as I expected her to be in the past & Owen was shown with a softer side that he seemed to shed after this personal tragedy & joining Torchwood. Ianto was part of Torchwood London was he? Interesting.

UNIT seemed to have kept the name but not the uniform of UNIT in the past. And they now look like the Para's & have the morals & manners of American soldiers in Guantánamo Bay.

Over all an impressive episode.

[Wayne]

Missed it thanks to the confusing scheduling. Will have to wait until the BBC2 transmission next Friday.

[WhiteCrow]

It was a good episode. Now I have to ask in 1999, was the Doctors hand already bubbling in the jar.

[chalkie]

It was a good episode. Now I have to ask in 1999, was the Doctors hand already bubbling in the jar.

no, according to timeline , hand severed 25/12/06 http://www.islandnet.com/~dascott/21to25c.htm

[Dirk Gently]

I think what Mike was alluding to was that the 1999 Torchwood had a bubbling jar with a hand in it & yet it wasn't removed until 7 years later.

[WhiteCrow]

I think what Mike was alluding to was that the 1999 Torchwood had a bubbling jar with a hand in it & yet it wasn't removed until 7 years later.

Definitely it was the same jar, but I'm not sure if there was a hand in it.

[Dirk Gently]

May be Jack has a thing for bubbles?

[Jason Thompson]

Not sure what to make of that one. An excuse for a flashback show. Nice touches, but some rather too obvious bits. Naturally the only one who suffered no dislocations or broken bones, but was in imminent danger of decapitation was the one who couldn't heal himself, and the only one who died was the one who couldn't. The two Torchwood gals were very poor actors indeed, IMO.

Tosh's story confused me a bit. The character was originally stated to have been the same hospital worker character in London that analysed the pig in Aliens Of London, which doesn't seem to square with her working in an office for the MOD and being taken to Cardiff five years before the episode. Since when did UNIT arrest people without charge and hold them indefinitely in crappy cells just to 'make an example' of them?

[Jason Thompson]

Ianto was part of Torchwood London was he? Interesting.

I believe that was established in Cyberwoman, since he managed to smuggle the conversion apparatus with Lisa from there into the Hub.

[Anthony Williams]

Tosh's story confused me a bit. The character was originally stated to have been the same hospital worker character in London that analysed the pig in Aliens Of London, which doesn't seem to square with her working in an office for the MOD and being taken to Cardiff five years before the episode.

Perhaps Torchwood sent her to investigate?

[Jason Thompson]

Perhaps Torchwood sent her to investigate?

Maybe, but that doesn't really square with it all either. Torchwood Cardiff sending one person to London, when Torchwood has its own London centre at this time? And Tosh reporting to General Asquith, a mere regular military officer that Torchwood is supposedly above and beyond?

Basically this is one writer discounting something that was established earlier in order to tell the story he wants to tell now, thus requiring absurd amounts of retcon to get it all to fit. He joins the tradition of Doctor Who writers well and truly with that!

Of course the explanation that fits better is that it was never stated on screen that Tosh is the same character that was seen in Aliens Of London, so I guess this episode's version of her story takes precedence.

[Dirk Gently]

Well, Torchwood was set up to capture & investigate the Doctor. Jack was never going to do that & as we saw, he was given control of Torchwood Cardiff in 1999 & he told Ianto that he had "severed ties" to Torchwood London (one can only assume because of his friendship with the Doctor) & thus if something was going on in London & Jack wanted to know about it then an undercover operative would be needed.

[WhiteCrow]

One thing I don't like, in the first few episodes, Jack was really a bit of an uncaring git, running Torchwood to contain and control alien menaces/technology, but not really too concerned of those caught in the crossfire. Saving the world didn't really seem on the menu.

It was Gwen's inclusion which refocused the way the group operated.

However it's almost like there's been a bit of back pedalling on this recently, with Jack saying to the Doctor he'd shaped to group as a tribute to the Doctor (yeah but only really recently cos of Gwen). The last couple of episodes, Adrift and Fractured seem to be more back pedalling, saying Jack really did care all along honest.

Just makes me feel a bit that they didn't really get the tone right in the first few episodes and they're trying to change that.

You might think differently - I'm wondering if it's just myself who feels this.

[Zbigniev Hamson]

Gratuitous "gay agenda" moment with the pointless lesbianisation of the old Torchwood ladies. And UNIT going all dark might have appealed to me when I was 14, but I just don't find things like that "cool" anymore.

[Wayne]

I quite enjoyed that. The back story stuff was good. This was the first episode where i liked Owen's character, really. Pretty decent ep overall. The only niggle was UNIT.

They seem to have turned into fascists since the Brig left though. No wonder the United Nations withdrew their backing.

UNIT seemed to have kept the name but not the uniform of UNIT in the past. And they now look like the Para's & have the morals & manners of American soldiers in Guantánamo Bay.

Agreed.

[Rob McCow]

Good grief! Ant Williams posted!

Well, it was a good episode overall, but there were a few daft bits which I'll point out now for my own gratuitous pleasure.

The line 'We need to take her brain back with us' made me laugh and laugh and laugh.

This was after I thought the Alzheimers bit was perhaps a little too close to being a bad-taste issue. Still, they had a leukemia kid a few weeks ago, so there's precedent.

The bit where the pterodactyl picks Jack up was utterly stupid.

I was dissapointed that in Tosh's past life, she wasn't best friends with Julia Sawalah. I'm still trying to tie Absolutely Fabulous into Torchwood continuity, because she's playing exactly the same character.

Ianto 'Coffee' Jones was impressive, but Andy 'Two Teas' was rejected from joining Torchwood for much the same reasons.

But there was loads that was great, it's hard to cock up a 'how the gang got together' episode. My favourite back story was probably... actually they were all rubbish.

[Rob McCow]

The only niggle was UNIT.

I really can't imagine the Brig, Benton and Mikey Yates imprisoning someone like that.

Brigadier Winifred Bambera on the other hand would just walk past the cell and say 'Oh shame.'

[Zbigniev Hamson]

This was after I thought the Alzheimers bit was perhaps a little too close to being a bad-taste issue.

Why exactly?

[WhiteCrow]

I'm looking forward to next weeks episode where it's revealed there's been plot elements all through the series which we didn't notice.

Either that or it's going to be naff. But I'll bet it'll include some gay kissing somewhere - he he he!

Glad to know I wasn't the only one who found the Victorian Lezzas a bit daft. I'm sure people will point out it's just because I'm not young and funky enough to "get" Torchwood.

[Rob McCow]

I think that using a recognised mental illness as a cheap plot device in a sci-fi telefantasy is kind of unpleasant.

[cyberchris35]

I thought the episode was good and as other people have stated there was the big problem with Tosh's backstory with her being in prisoned by UNIT years before she was in the hospital with the pig alien. The nurse was named Sato in the episode because I have read it in the Doctor Who season one script book. If pushed they could use the excuse they used when they put Freema in as the compaion after she had already been in an episode and say she was a relative.
Tosh's story aside the rest were reasonable I liked seeing Ianto out of his suit and Owen's story was the strongest of the lot.
I can't wait for next week and the last episode hope it lives up to it's build up.

[Jonno]

the big problem with Tosh's backstory with her being in prisoned by UNIT years before she was in the hospital with the pig alien.

Big problem? We know that AOL was set in 2006, and with the Whoniverse running one year in the future since then, Martha would have left the Doctor in 2008 and we can assume that Torchwood S2 is set in 2009. Therefore, Tosh would have joined in 2004, just 2 years before AOL where, as others have surmised on this or similar threads, she can easily be working undercover for Torchwood Cardiff.