Rate & Discuss 4.6: The Doctor's Daughter

[Antony Cox]

It was fine, OP - it was noting special. I found it all a bit cheesy to be honest - it was one of those episodes when I was waiting for something to happen and it never did.

One thing struck me though - I suddenly realised how much DT's performance as the Doctor is actually very simliar to Tom's, though I much prefer Tom's by a long chalk.

VERY much looking forward to next week's episode though!

[Larry]

Martha didn't have that much to do either, other than her unlikely friendship with one of the Haath* .

yeh you get the feeling that Martha was only included in this episode so we could see thing from the Hath's point of view.

[Zbigniev Hamson]

Tonight Matthew, I'm going to be... Zbigniev Hamson!! By which I mean I didn't really like it much at all (sorry Zbigniev).

It's funny this comes up now, my marks this year have been far higher than the last couple of years

apart from the 1 there's been a 4 a 5 a 7 and an 8, and this one will be 7 or 8 again when I actually vote

[Philipnet]

A bunch of one dimensional characters.

I did like the twist - the 7 day war! , but I would have expected to see some attrition on the Human side of things, not just the Hath.

3 / 10.

[JohnMan]

I thought the episode was OK, but nothing special. It should have been FANTASTIC since it introduced a new (major) character in Jenny. (Can't wait till the next time her and the Doctor team up and he says "Me and Jenny, we are like peas and carrots again" like Forrest Gump.) The first few minutes where a major let down.... The "birth" of the Doctors daughter was too rushed, and because of that, it lacked all positive emotional impact. To me, the major storyline of the Doctors daughter seemed very... unoriginal. I can't say I hated it, but thats because I love Doctor Who. But I can't say I loved it, because I feel like Ive seen it before. The thing I DID like about the episode was that we have some different, and original aliens called the Hath. I dug them because they seemed new and fresh... thankfully, they weren't any type of mutated swine. Martha didn't seem too important in the episode, but she served a purpose. Still, it would have been nicer if she had a more important part of the story since she was the visiting guest star. Another thing I liked was Tennant being more subdued. While I love Doctor number 10... sometimes his hyperactive vocal approach annoys me.

Overall, this episode SHOULD have been better. I'm calling it now, Jenny will show up in next seasons Sarah Jane Adventures. Just wait and see...

[chalkie]

anyone taking bets on how long it takes jenny to appear in TW?
(what would they call the jenny spin off series? "she was only the doctors daughter but her dimensions filled time and space" ? any other suggestions on a postard please....)

[chalkie]

yep Georgia Moffett, is bloody gorgeous...

where's that pic from, imdb doesn't show her in "red dawn " either, or am i looking in the wrong place?
it just clicked , nigel terry ( that general) king arthur in excalibur, am i slow

[Andy Frankham]

Well, I don't have much more to add to the already expressed views on this thread. Wasn't a bad episode, but it wasn't brilliant either. Jenny's origins were a complete let down, and the thing with the Doctor's hand was bollocks (and seriously, getting tired of the sloppy writers'-shorthand approach of these things). But loved Jenny herself, loved the seven day war, loved Donna and Martha, and the last few scenes with Jenny were kind of fab.

So a 7 for me. Should have been sooo much better.

[Captain Tancredi]

I'm hoping they resist the temptation to use Jenny again for a while- it's become so refreshing to have a character who by definition doesn't have any baggage or angst that I'd rather they used her properly in two or three years than brought her back quickly for the sake of it.

[WhiteCrow]

A bunch of one dimensional characters.

I did like the twist - the 7 day war! , but I would have expected to see some attrition on the Human side of things, not just the Hath.

3 / 10.

Humanity is the real monster - a recurring theme so far - just this season we've had their mistreatment of the Ood, UNIT's aggression, and now the war against the Haath.

Don't forget Torchwood gunning down a retreating ship ... the season finale anyone?

[Stephen Morgan]

I can't really add anything more to this than has already been said.
Opinions seem to be genuinely positive about the episode, I enjoyed it and thought it was another good one. I've given it a nine.

This is the episode that was partly filmed in Newbridge Memo back in December, just across the street from me. Shame I couldn't get in there to see some of the filming, but I did get a sneaky look at the set before they started, (I picked up a couple of blank bullets off the floor) when the scenes came up onscreen I recognised them straightaway. I had a good look around the set, taking everything in, the cell where the Doctor, Jenny and Donna were locked, the cloning machine from which Jenny emerged, even looking at Alice Troughton's clapperboards.
They filmed in Newbridge for five days in total, even getting interviewed for local radio, but do you think I could even get a sniff of any action, not a chance, missed them every time, and in my birthday week too.

[Wayne]

where's that pic from?

I cropped it, but it's originally from here:

http://www.angelfire.com/film/georgi...tt/gallery.htm

[Stuart Wallis]

So why would anyone think that the DW team were all firing blanks, Steve?

Ahem!

Back to the plot. This was for me by far the worst of the current series to date. It just seemed like one of the poorer, less engaging NDA/TDAs, the worst of which are derivative of eachother. The Hath were good, but as has been said, the glass wossname where their mouths should be seemed impractical. Some of the major plot points were so obvious I saw them coming a continent's width off, let alone a mile; I'm referring mainly to the Hath seeing the map as well, Martha's friend sacrificing itself, the Doctor's change of feelings over Jenny and using the Device to bring the opposing forces together, his not shooting the general, and Jenny's death and subsequent resurrection.

Other things weren't right either. How did Martha know that Jenny wasn't going to regenerate? What did the Doctor's hand have to do with anything? How was that small amount of pollenny stuff going to terraform an entire planet? How did it get into Jenny? The general gave the best performance of the entire guest cast, but he was given a lot of cliches to spout, and why, if we're to assume he'd not been alive a week, did he have a different accent to anybody else? Why had nobody realised that the war had only lasted a week, and how did the history of the war become so garbled so quickly? The numbers on the building suggested, if Donna's logic is correct, that the building is still being made, but why do we not see any signs of ongoing construction? Who's doing the building work anyway?

Bring me my frog pills, I've gone all OG!

I did enjoy the regulars' performances and the sets, but I just saw too much wrong with the story, and not enough plot to get my fangs into. And Georgia Moffett doesn't do anything for me, I'm afraid.



2/10

[Stephen Morgan]

So why would anyone think that the DW team were all firing blanks, Steve?

That wasn't the one
It was the one about Alice Troughton's clapperboards which I thought someone would pick up on after I'd posted .

I think I'm just rambling.

[Stuart Wallis]

I do it all the time and no-one's noticed... (Rambling, not firing - oh )

[Dirk Gently]

...but do you think I could even get a sniff of any action, not a chance...and in my birthday week too.

Not even from the missus, Steve? That's just not on. It was your birthday after all...what do you mean 'not that kind of action?'

[Stephen Morgan]

See... they pick on the meanings I don't even notice..

[Andrew Curnow]

Oh yes, we pride ourselves on our thoroughness here at PS, Steve!

Going back to Stuart's post, the one thing I think I might defend (having also not really enjoyed this episode much) is the building of the city - the Doctor mentions robot drones making them, moving out from the centre, so logically speaking they would be constantly out beyond where the humans and Hath are. And since they were underground until the end, Martha wouldn't have seen them 'up top' either.

[Milky Tears]

I was going to mention the "sniff of any action" bit earlier...












but thought I'd leave it for Hawny Hawny Hawtin.

[Jon Masters]

I must be seriously losing it, because I quite enjoyed this week ! so I gave it 7/10

Things I liked - the overall plot was good, and held together (even though the idea of short lived humans artificially produced with a mythical understanding of real events completely destroys a long-standing idea I've had for a DW story ). The Hath looked good, and I liked that we didn't hear their voices, and the nice contrast with the behaviour of the humans. that the Doctor kept his anti-gun stance, and despite the odd 'MARRRRFFFFFA', DTs performance was pretty much on the money. Ms Moffett was pretty much perfect too - not too cloying, or annoying.

Things that let the story down - Donna's trick of the week was wedged in to make her of any use (beware future epsiodes of 'Oh yeah - I rebuilt tank engines for a year when I was in Fulham' style new skills). Martha's tumble and the Hath's sacrifice were useless and insulting. And while Gen Cobb was well played IMO it would have been better with a younger actor (otherwise why is Cobb so much older and Wurzle like ?)
Unfortunately the last 3 minutes were also a hugely expected cliche, and not a very welcome delvelopment (and how did she know how to find the shuttle, let alone pilot it ?)

There were a couple of science-annoyances too - how come the Doctor produces a daughter when all the rest appeared to be male (and unless there are more women around I can't see how the human colony is going to survive even with the machines, unless it all goes a bit Incesty ) ? I don't think any technology is designed to work by being broken, but I suppose it made a dramatic scene.

Next week looks very impressive though

[Dirk Gently]

(and how did she know how to find the shuttle, let alone pilot it ?)

Jon, she was 'born' knowing how to talk, walk, eat, speak, fight as a fully trained soldier & knew who her father was...I think the fact that she knew where to find a shuttle & pilot it is the least of it, don't you?

[Andrew Curnow]

probably, but... was the planet Messaline named after Peter Messaline who provided some of the Dalek voices for Day of the Daleks?

Incidentally, according to IMDB he's Canadian!

[Zbigniev Hamson]

The numbers on the building suggested, if Donna's logic is correct, that the building is still being made, but why do we not see any signs of ongoing construction? Who's doing the building work anyway?

As far as I recall the highest number/date they saw stamped on the walls was a week before the current date. That's how they worked out the war had only been going on a week in the first place isn't it? I don't think anything had been built in the week since the commander died and the war started.

[Jon Masters]

Jon, she was 'born' knowing how to talk, walk, eat, speak, fight as a fully trained soldier & knew who her father was...I think the fact that she knew where to find a shuttle & pilot it is the least of it, don't you?

Sorry, Tim, I didn't explain myself very well - what I meant was that if we have to assume the machine didn't implant any of the information about the temple's location, the fact it was a ship, the war only being seven days old etc, why would it bother to implant information about flying a shuttle which no-one appeared to know anything about ?

It's nice to have at least a minor niggle to worry about, otherwise I might never sleep at night looking for important issues to worry about !

Oh, and on the abbreviation front - dead easy - TD'sD

[Paul Clement]

And while Gen Cobb was well played IMO it would have been better with a younger actor (otherwise why is Cobb so much older and Wurzle like ?)

I've been thinking about this, and have come to a possible conclusion why General Cobb is so much older than everyone else.

If the machines have been adapted to create soldiers at the start of adulthood, then it's quite possible that the machine was purposefully built to allow the creation of an overall officer of the human army that is older than the rest of his army as his age would lend him an instinctive authority.