DWM #508: The 70s

[SiHart]

The new DWM, out this week:

[Jon Masters]

Foolishly I had forgotten that to avoid spoilers I shouldn't actually read anything other than the comic strip and the Fact ofFiction

[Rob McCow]

I enjoyed Deep Breath so much I read the Capaldi interview and several other sections of Doctor Who Magazine! It's the first time in years.

The comic strip was sort of OK, but I'm still not convinced that Geraghty can draw a person in a physically attainable pose. And I was so very, very tired of the full-page-beauty-shot to introduce a new Doctor / Companion about eight years ago. Bah! But then I'm miserable.

[Nyder]

I enjoyed the third part of the Terrance interview, and the Silas Hawkins one too! Peter went through hell to get those Cyber voices!


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[Martin Geraghty]

I enjoyed Deep Breath so much I read the Capaldi interview and several other sections of Doctor Who Magazine! It's the first time in years.

The comic strip was sort of OK, but I'm still not convinced that Geraghty can draw a person in a physically attainable pose. And I was so very, very tired of the full-page-beauty-shot to introduce a new Doctor / Companion about eight years ago. Bah! But then I'm miserable.

Hi Rob.

Sorry to hear you're struggling with my work - believe me, I'm my own fiercest critic so I can sympathise. If I had the luxury of time to craft these pages 'til they sang I would but deadlines in this business are punishing, unfortunately, so you just have to send stuff out warts and all. There are various levels of scrutiny these things go through before they leave my desk, irrespective of losses in translation during the inking and colouring processes so if you can point out to me the panels where the figure work is particularly weak I'll see if we're on the same page.

I think you're always gonna be stuck with the hero shot of a new Doctor. tbh, (particularly during this strip where circumstance dictated he had to be left out of the action for the majority of it)
I certainly wouldn't have it any other way, nor would most of the readership I imagine.

Cheers.
M

[Rob McCow]

Oh blimey! Nobody reads Planet Skaro any more!

Yes well cough anyway hello Martin! Seeing as your here I'll try to give you a decent response...

First, I'll get the obvious out of the way I can't draw for toffee and am deeply envious of anyone who could produce a comic strip and have a person be recognisable from one panel to the next. I can appreciate that the work on DWM is demanding, especially for one of the last magazines that's bucking the trend of declining sales (I think that's right isn't it?)

I've been quite vociferous about spin-off Doctor Who. The TV show is back and it's generally damn good, so for the audios and the comic strip to be worthwhile I think they either have to offer something different or just be brilliant.

Anyway, the comic strip! I haven't been a huge fan of the DWM strip since the show came back, sadly. Why? Maybe because I'm older. But then I enjoyed the reprints when they were re-issued, from Dragon's Claw to Endgame and especially the end of the McGann run. Now that the show has been running for almost 10 years, the comic strip is always starting off on the back foot. I'm predisposed to disliking it, which is tremendously unfair of me. I'm also entrenched in my opinions, which may or may not be fair! I think the computer colouring and effects make it look too slick, which is a personal taste thing. I find a lot of modern comics off-putting for the same reason. I'm also aware that artists would never get a colour strip done in time without computers. Also they are massively underpaid.

Aw sod it. Let's do this. Bear in mind (raah) I know nothing about comics. Sorry if I disappear up my own arse talking about this.

Page one:
Cocoa cup! Lovely. Top right panel the characters are fairly indistinct, but that's fine, we can see them clearly further down. Sets up the cold base, looks dark and mysterious. I think the dispenser is too brightly coloured and distracts from the rest of the page, it's big and yellow, but it probably shouldn't be the centre of attention. You know what bugs me? By panel 5 we've learned the following: They have drinks dispensers, it's got colder, we've met Florence Dell and Sandy, we've established they're sarcastic and a bit fed up, they play poker, Sandy has a mysterious message that she's been working on, she's been decoding it for a while, it might be a stray transmission... I think it's a little too much information. This is a regular thing with me, a comic strip is about the images and the dialogue should be stripped back to the minimum.

There are a couple of nice clear panels showing Flo and Sandy's faces, which I do like. The hologram effect in the central panel isn't very interesting, but then I suppose it's functional. I don't understand how the hologram relates to the signal that Sandy has found.

Bottom middle, the two girls are running and it looks more comic-ey / stylised. But we're rushing through to the page turn!

Page Two:
Clara! She looks very nice, though I think she's doing something odd with her right leg. When we get these introductory pictures, I think it needs to be as accurate as possible. I don't think the nose is quite right, Jenna has a little button nose. I really like her outfit.

We've got a few more functional panels to the right of that, as Clara talks her way out of trouble. These all look good, I like the pic of Flo. The likeness of Jenna at the bottom left isn't so good, but the other ones on that page are nice. Then at the bottom right we've got the three characters going up in a lift, I think. It's clear enough what's going on, but it doesn't seem to quite match the basic-looking ice-room we saw earlier on.

Page Three:
Ah, this is interesting. Andy Warhol! Nice way to introduce a character as an over-indulged ego-maniac. The laughing face is quite cool. I guess it's on a video screen, there's no texture or shadow on the picture. It looks flat. Got a good group of people, with the laughing guy standing out by being bigger than everyone else. I like the middle right image of him laughing (again!). The bottom right image of Clara seems a bit wonky though. Doesn't matter too much because it's time for:

Page Four and Five:
The text is the wrong way round on the left. The first words I read are "THE SUN!" then I have to go back and read what he's saying about it. If "THE SUN!" had been at the top, then I'd have followed it through. The sun looks lovely. I like the little 'shocked' circle picture of Clara bottom right page five.

Page Six:
The colour palette of the spaceship interior has changed from blue/white to turquoise. Good contrast with the red and yellow. Problem here is we're meeting another two characters and in a few panels the conversation goes from plasma extraction to poker to a death threat to tapping into energy feeds... I'm a bit lost. Sorry, I know that's not the artwork. The top right panel looks rushed, but what's really odd is that Alice seems to be much shorter than Harriet and Georgia. Yet because that's not shown clearly in any of the early panels, it looks like she might be standing lower down or something.

Then Georgia sees a hand coming out of the flame, which looks pretty good.

Page Seven:
Mr Zoom! Hmm. That explains the big Z's everywhere. The main room has gone from silvery blue to red and pink. Mr Zoom is very recognisable throughout all the panels, a distinctive character, well realised. The image of Clara isn't so good middle left. I can still pick out Flo and Sandy in all the panels too. So the main characters all stand out, the background characters are more sketchy but then that's probably how it should be!

Page Eight:
Some great strong images on this page. I don't think it needed the text panels at all as we get the images of Georgia's eye. It takes away all the impact because I can take in the image at a glance, so I have to go back and read the text afterwards. The story is being told in text, but (I know I'm being a self-important arsehole saying this) it should be visual.

Page Nine:
Somehow the text panels work better on this page! Can't fault this really. Tells the story, looks good, I particularly like the facial expression in the top at the middle for Harriet. We're back with the dingier design for the spaceship, which we didn't get so much in the plasma room.

Page Ten:
Good monster. Nice to have a monster that makes use of an art effect, with the pure black and white. They couldn't really do that on TV so well. Good stuff all the way. Things are motoring along now though I would have liked to have ditched the text panels. The dialogue in the speech bubbles is great and good enough on it's own.

Page Eleven:
The second panel down looks a bit contorted, but then Alice has just been pulled over by alien tentacles so it fits. I like the build up to the Doctor's appearance. I thought this was good stuff - I read it a few days before seeing Deep Breath, so it was his first appearance in a regular adventure!

Page Twelve:
OK, you can hate me now. The Doctor's legs are too far apart, his left hand looks too big. The face likeness is good and it fits in with the style of the comic strip, so it's really hard to pin down why it doesn't feel quite right for me. He does look like a superhero in this image which in my view is exactly the right thing to do for most comics, but because it's a TV tie-in and because it's Doctor Who, I don't like it.

I really like the way you've drawn Alice on this page.

So... having gone over it in more detail than I have done for any comic strip in years, what don't I like about it? Too much text which slows up the story. There are loads of ideas but they don't get a chance to breath. Not sure if the changes of colour palette work. In terms of the drawing work, there's a lot that I really like but the sketchier panels detract from that a bit. They tell the story though. I'm never going to like the hero poses and they're not going away, so I should get over it.

There was a lot to like in the comic strip - the characters were distinctive, the sun effects were great, Clara's outfit, the monster and the fact you got twelve (!) pages out and none of them had to be left blank, which is I'm sure what would happen if I'd ever got into doing comic strips.

I think the comic strip would benefit from simpler stories, a smaller number of characters and not being so much like a new series episode. Though I think I might be buggered wishing for that last one, because it probably has to be as much like a new series episode as possible.

I've probably been totally patronising here and you're more than in your rights to tell me to f-off. On the other hand, welcome once again to our little forum!

[Andrew Curnow]

I haven't got as far as the strip yet so can't comment - but if nothing else, for knowing what you do & don't like Steve, and for explaining it so well.

[Martin Geraghty]

Oh blimey! Nobody reads Planet Skaro any more!


I've probably been totally patronising here and you're more than in your rights to tell me to f-off. On the other hand, welcome once again to our little forum!

Thanks for the detailed response there Rob (or is it Steve?!), it's actually mightily constructive to have a one-to-one with someone who looks at the strip objectively like yourself, as so much of the process is batting between Panini and the BBC and the inker David that it all becomes a bit insular.

I can definitely appreciate where you're coming from in terms of the stuff you've been good enough to point out- Clara is quite difficult to capture in line actually, as in terms of simple black and white she's a generic, pretty woman-I mean that in the nicest possible sense! I've actually resorted to tracing photo-ref of her in a lot of panels but there's just something that's difficult to capture. I think maybe the dimple and her fuller cheeks can't be drawn in so few lines -too much linework and the person is aged.
I agree it's a tricky one- The best piccy is the one of her on the spread shot of the Sun, yes.

I'd have made different decision's with that final shot now if possible- as soon as a page has left the drawing board you come up with an infinite amount of ways of doing it better! It was a hero shot, as requested- We had to keep Peter out of the strip as long as possible prior to transmission naturally so it seemed natural for him to have a nice big splash page as an intro. I'd have altered the pose, made him less front-on, tipped his head down, but eh, what's done is done. If you ever meet a comic artist who's pleased with the majority of what he's done he's probably lying! This is probably not the best stuff I've done nor the worst but it's done on time and fulfils it's function. I've not seen all of Part 2 inked and coloured up yet-I hope I've been able to capture the 12th Doctor more as the story progresses, the actor himself has made encouraging noises so hopefully that'll continue.

But many thanks again for such a detailed response- it wasn't patronising at all and I appreciate you going to the effort. It's all a learning curve!

best wishes,
Martin

[MacNimon]

Brilliant!!!

It's nice to see Steve put so much thought into what he didn't like about Martin's work, and just as nice seeing Martin registering here just to make his initial comment. It's easy to criticise an artist whose work you don't like (just like it's easy for a football fan to criticise a team manager or player), but much harder to specify what exactly it is that you don't like. It's probably more honest and easier simply to say that an artist's style isn't to your taste, everyone just has different tastes don't they?

Well done to both of you, that made for great reading!

[Rob McCow]

I quite enjoyed going over the comic strip like that. Made me appreciate all the more the effort that has to go into a comic strip. I'm also fascinated by the creative process - I love those bits at the back of the Doctor Who collected comics / graphic novels.

PS It is Steve by the way, the Rob McCow thing is a hangover from when nobody ever used their real name online.

[Stuart Wallis]

You mean your real name really is Betty?!

[MacNimon]

I'll have to buy this months issue now just to read the comic strip!

[Dirk Gently]

PS It is Steve by the way, the Rob McCow thing is a hangover from when nobody ever used their real name online.

People don't use thier real names!? That's just wrong, they should have thier anoraks taken away.

[Stuart Wallis]

You mean your real name isn't Betty?

[Nyder]

There's a lovely story in the Robot of Sherwood preview of Mark Gatiss visiting his sister-in-law's school. It warmed the cockles of my heart :-)


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[SiHart]

It was the 35th anniversary of the first issue coming out, yesterday

[SiHart]

New issue this week!

[Rob McCow]

"We're going to see the stabilisers fall off for Danny"

I think this is going to be literal - we will see young Danny riding a bike and his stabilisers will fall off. It'll be a big moment when Clara's time-travelling daughter will wipe the graze on his knee.

[Jon Masters]

Why are the Cybermen going to appear in Downton Abbey ?

[Dirk Gently]

[Stuart Wallis]

The Daleks are appearing in The Suspicions Of Mr. Whicher, why not?

[Rob McCow]

Reminds me of the time The Animus turned up in Middlemarch.

[Jon Masters]

Seriously, what's going on with Capaldi's hair in that photo ? Where's his Pertwee-esque Boufant ?

[Stuart Wallis]

He's worked out that Jenna's remarks about him going bald were a joke...

[Nyder]

That Derrick Sherwin interview is interesting. He certainly doesn't hold back I'm surprised his comments about Moffat were actually published!


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