Rate and Discuss: Vincent and the Doctor

[SiHart]

Was it a masterpiece or a fake? You decide!

Si xx

[Lord President]

I loved it, I even had a tear in my eye when Bill Nighy was discussing his love of Vincent. If it hadn't been for The Doctor flailing wildly at an invisible monster and the virtual lack of any mention of Rory it might have been a 10!

[Si Hunt]

I thought it was a great episode.

Croatia worked wonderfully well for the second time, and looked like a different location to the first; the corn fields and cottages were absolutely beautiful and looked glorious on screen. Although clearly budget driven, the invisible monster was marvellous, even if it did resemble a big hen. Best of all was the portrayal of Vincent by Tony Curran, wonderfully real portraying depression and his tortured artistic soul.

I wasn't sure when they took him into the TARDIS whether this was spoiling the story - for once, maybe it would have been better to have never reavealed who the Doctor and Amy were? - but when they got to the Gallery and he saw his paintings it turned into the "pay off" - a brilliantly moving moment. That's said with my heart - with my (fan) brain I wonder if this was rather a reckless act by the Doctor; Amy was surprised when Vincent's visit to the Gallery hadn't perked up his future life, but if it had surely history would have taken a bit of a hit?

I think this one will be a future classic though, as it really had soul. Aside from some overbearing music, it looked gorgeous, really felt and had at its centre a wonderful, wonderful centre performance. I thought Bill Nighy was a bit wooden at the start, but his scene at the end was played perfectly.

Now I'm off to ring the help line and complain about Murray Gold's music.

Si.

[Dino]

Easily numbs out the pain from the last two week's Chris! It could only work once! Richard Curtis should never write another Doctor Who story again, he got it spot on with this!
I loved how the monster was misunderstood. More sympathetic than the climax to Vampires In Venice.
I will enjoy or be bored of the last ten minutes when I see it again but it was movingly shot. All the crucial elements of these Curtis films for one night only.
So despite the CGI, the monster's situation and how it's reacting to it puts this up at 10 for the first time in weeks!
That said, I'm hoping that'll be the last bit of sentiment we'll see in the rest of the series for the rest of the run?

[Si Hunt]

That said, I'm hoping that'll be the last bit of sentiment we'll see in the rest of the series for the rest of the run?

I don't honestly think you're going to get your wish there.

Si.

[Dino]

Now I'm off to ring the help line and complain about Murray Gold's music.

Si.

What the hell was with that being put up? Over sensitive still?

[Wayne]

2/10.
30 minutes of dull non-story, following by an dreadfully unsubtle 15 minute emo-fest that felt so fake that i was reaching for the sick bucket. Worst story since RTD.

[Andrew Curnow]

OMG I agree with Wayne. Surely one of the signs of the end of the world!!

[Andrew Curnow]

Tony Curran was superb as Van Goch, but I think his brilliant portrayal was a little wasted in something like Doctor Who. V-e-r-y schmaltzy episode, not enough story, too much unsubtle emotionalising (which may or may not be a word), and at the risk of sounding like a snob, very Richard Curtis-y. Sorry but not my cup o'tea at all.

[Milky Tears]

Nudging a ten.

Superb performance from Curran.

Almost as superb as Moffat's hair!

[Alex]

I've mixed feelings about this one. I felt it took to long to get going, and as I'm personally not a huge fan of Van Gogh's work, I couldn't join in with the Doctor and Amy's hero worshipping. Plus the monster really should have been developed further, though I get that it's a metaphor for depression itself.

The Doctor handily finding a contraption that allowed him to see it seemed a bit too convenient, and when he started trying to use the sonic screwdriver against it, for the first time I found myself thinking "Oh not the ****ing sonic screwdriver again". I know a lot of people feel it's overused, but this was the first time for me...

That all said, Tony Curran was absolutely superb as Van Gogh. His portrayal was one of the finest bits of acting I think I've ever seen in Who, and he made for a character I found myself having a deep affinity with. I just wish they could have made him a companion for a few episodes, which I think could have been a really brave move for the series. And certainly make things more interesting when Rory inevitably returns.

I loved his scene in the gallery (though Bill Nighy was a bit wasted really), despite the choice of music to play over that scene, and it pretty much redeemed the whole the episode.

A really difficult one to score as it was a game of two halves (Brian), but 7/10 seems about right to me.

[duncan]

I'm totally indifferent as I have been all series.

[Si Hunt]

when he started trying to use the sonic screwdriver against it, for the first time I found myself thinking "Oh not the ****ing sonic screwdriver again".

For once I don't think the Sonic Screwdriver Haters can object this week, as it turned out not to actually have any effect. The Doctor even said he should use it less often!

Random thought - good job the curator did his bit about "Van Gogh committed suicide at 37" on their return visit, and not when Van Gogh was present. That would have put the cat amongst the pigeons.

Si.

[Darren]

Ironically it was like watching paint dry.

4 out of 10

Truly the dullest episode I have seen.

Does Richard Curtis have an obsession with Van Gogh? The whole episode centred around the Doctor and Amy worshipping the man. The monster in the cornfield felt as if it was tacked on as an afterthought.
In Paris, the Doctor said he recognised pure evil, yet in 1892(?) he said they were naturally brutal when separated from the herd. Which doesn't make it any more evil than a tiger.
And how exactly can it be invisible? What's going on with its biological make up there? And why can Vincent see it?

And as mentioned the last bit was atrociously cheesy and nausea inducing. The Unquiet Dead has already shown how to pay respect to a historical character whilst wrapping an exciting story around him.

[Lissa]

Once a season they seem to have an in-jokes episode - Dickens, Shakespeare, Agatha Christie and now Van Gogh. They're fine if you get the jokes but, apart from Christie, I never have. This episode also had a huge amount of hugging and a script editing credit for Emma Freud. It would also have been nice to have had some kind of explanation as to why only Vincent could see the monster.

But those are fairly minor quibbles. It was an episode where the blobby monster was there but it wasn't the be all and end all of everything. Vincent wasn't pushed to the sidelines to make way for the guest CGI of the week. The monster was just a device to get the Doctor there and keep him there while we got to know Van Gogh a bit better.

The ending felt a bit drawn out but I'm sure second time around, when we know what's to come, it will feel a more natural part of the story. I felt a bit let down but only because I saw there were 10 minutes left (of the advertised 50 minutes) and assumed there would be something huge at the end to set up the final phase of the season. The cast running up stairs and revisiting the same small gallery several times didn't quite live up to my expectations.

I've given it yet another 8/10. The cast were all magnificent (we had another look at Matt Smith's old man walk which is a much underrated part of his characterisation), the themes running through the episode worked well with the story, the gizmo - a tad convenient to say the least - at least looked cool and Karen Gillan's chest deserves special mention in the scene where they're all lying in the field.

The best season in Doctor Who's long history just keeps on going.

[Captain Tancredi]

Once a season they seem to have an in-jokes episode - Dickens, Shakespeare, Agatha Christie and now Van Gogh. They're fine if you get the jokes but, apart from Christie, I never have. This episode also had a huge amount of hugging and a script editing credit for Emma Freud.

I feel safe in saying that Emma Freud is the only Who script editor I've ever fancied like mad (back in the days of The Late Show). I don't think there were that many in-jokes, though- Bill Nighy was clearly doing his impression of Brian Sewell, though, and I did like the brief double-take where van Gogh is momentarily distracted by a late Monet in the Orsay (which, coincidentally, might just be my single favourite place in the world ever). Apart from that, mostly sight gags based on the paintings everybody knows- and that's part of the problem with van Gogh, the paintings are so well known while the man, because of his battles with mental illness, isn't so accessible. Such as it was, the plot seemed wafer-thin but I'm waiting for the sequel where the Doctor and Amy visit Gustave Courbet and Amy prompts a slight change in the hair colour on show in 'L'Origine du Monde' (and you'll have to look that up!).

[Alex]

For once I don't think the Sonic Screwdriver Haters can object this week, as it turned out not to actually have any effect. The Doctor even said he should use it less often!

Well it was the first time it annoyed me and I'm not quite sure why it was this episode in particular, but yes, I guess the payoff that it didn't have any effect was a good (and much needed) one.

Random thought - good job the curator did his bit about "Van Gogh committed suicide at 37" on their return visit, and not when Van Gogh was present. That would have put the cat amongst the pigeons.

True, and that they turned up when Bill Nighy was working, and not on a day where someone else thought Van Gogh was a bit rubbish!

[Zbigniev Hamson]

For me the whole thing just dragged up painful memories of when I was also terrorised by an invisible space chicken. I'm just glad they put up a helpline number at the end really.

[Andrew Curnow]

Vis-a-vis the sonic, I actually thought it didn't appear much this week. On the other hand, we had that ridiculous contraption that not only identifies creatures, but allows you to see even invisible ones, but only when they're behind you!! Is that really better than having an all-purpose sonic? At least the sonic doesn't look stupid when you have it about your person!

Sorry - I guess we're all the same in that when there's something we don't like, we're then less forgiving of things which normally we'd let go. So there's a lot of things irritating me now about this episode, stupid strap-on gizmos being just one of them. I'll bugger off for now I think!!

[MinaHarker]

the virtual lack of any mention of Rory

I counted four separate allusions to Rory: a)The Doctor sputtering when Amy asks why he is being so nice to her b)Van Gogh noticing that she has "lost someone" c)The Doctor saying "Rory" and d)Amy saying she's not the marrying kind. I think that's enough mentioning of Rory for one episode!

And how exactly can it be invisible? What's going on with its biological make up there? And why can Vincent see it?

Don't know, don't know and possibly the same reason he sees everything differently (as shown by the night sky turning into Starry Night).


I need to think about this for a while. I gave it 7/10 because I did enjoy it, although I am not a fan of Van Gogh's work.

I rather enjoyed him being taken through time to see how his work is revered - at the time of the episodes I rather wished that Shakespeare, Cristie and Dickens could see that so I was glad someone did.

I enjoyed the Doctor fighting an invisible alien, although the giant chicken looked a bit crap. I loved the mention of the overuse of the sonic screwdriver, and I was so glad it didn't work for once!

I cried at the end.

[Si Hunt]

The whole notion of human genius' - revered, famous artists - being somehow more than human, capable of instantly understanding and guessing about the Doctors travels in time, is a point of contention. On the one hand, there's no reason why all geniuses/people capable of greater understanding, were born into a time when science or technology could fully utilise them, and it's a good guess that these people must have been people like Dickins and Van Gogh, who displayed evidence of huge talent and output even in primitive times. On the other hand, it's a little romantised and Van Gogh just might have been an ordinary bloke who was good at painting.

I think it's okay overall, as long as they don't hammer the point home too much. The next historical great they meet should be as incredulous about time travel as anyone else, because having created a posthumously admired painting or book shouldn't always mean our legendary artists are neglected Stephen Hawkings.

Si.

[Larry]

on first viewing a solid 7 - I enjoyed it but like most episaodes I think I'll need to give it a 2nd viewing there were some lovely moments in it especialy at the end when the doctor takes van gough , to the future to see his paintings had become a success.

[Andrew Curnow]

That last bit was one thing I really did feel uncomfortable about. The episode had already established that during his last year Van Goch produced an amazing amount of work - as a triumph of the human spirit, against constant and universal rejection (again, also established in the episode), that's tremendously impressive. We've all had rejections I'm sure, and it's never easy to pick yourself up and carry on - that Vincent could is a tremendous feat (and certainly something to go on the Doctor's pile of good things in his life). Somehow, for me anyway, to be saying that no, actually he wasn't carrying on despite rejection, the reason was that he was aware that in the future he would be a hugely famous 'success', takes so much away from the character.

Edited to add: I know it's only a work of fiction, and I'm also aware I was on the other side of the "is Fires of Pompeii insensitive" argument a couple of years back! I guess I'm just funny that way!

[SiHart]

I thought that was absolutely magnificent. Incredibly moving and great use of a great Athlete song as they took Vincent to the Musee D'Orcy. It just really got under my skin in a way I wasn't expecting it too this morning. I'm not sure I can really explain why either. Sorry. I just loved it.

Si xx

[matthewsch]

9/10. It didn't feel like Doctor Who to me, but that's the beauty of the program - it can take anything under the sun and make an amazing episode out of it. This episode did emotion in a way that the RTD era could only have dreamed of (the emo-Doctor aspect of the RTD era got very stale, very quickly). What let down the episode was taking Vincent to the gallery, it was cliched and stupid. Also, the CGI creature was awful, and having Vincent as a super-genius just because he's a good painter was annoying. It worked okay with Shakespeare, but not here.

However, the best bit was the very end, when we saw that Vincent had dedicated the painting to Amy (it was sad hearing her talk about marriage as if Rory had never existed). It was really touching, and some great music there. I didn't notice most of the music in the episode (so why is everyone nutting on about Murray Gold?) but that bit was beautiful.