Sherlock Holmes

[Andrew Curnow]

I got given the complete Holmes for Christmas. My brother had them about 25 years ago, and I vaguely remember starting to read them but giving up out of sheer boredom... but I was totally wrong, and have really rattled through (so far) the stories up to and including The Final Problem. I'm enjoying them enormously, but find myself intrigued by 'peripheral' issues that I suspect maybe even the internet can't help me with.

For example...

We have UNIT dating - I suspect that in Holmes circles there is endless debate about the order of the stories. Some have a very specific date, others have a more general "in the year XXXX", while others still refer to "not long after" or "just before" Watson's marriage. I've not been taking notes, but even my casual eye has begun to spot that the may not be wholly consistent.

But-- but-- I find myself, as I say, full of questions. Did Conan Doyle pick specific dates with some kind of 'overall Holmes timeline' in mind? And assuming not, why bother flipping backwards and forwards in time between stories - why set one earlier than a previous one, what is the point? Easier surely just to have each story as 'the next' one?

And-- and-- Next up is The Hound of the Baskervilles. I think it's fair to say that it's the most well known, the most famous, of all the Holmes stories. But until I looked it up on Wikipedia I never realised that it was the first new story after Holmes was (apparently) killed off, and marked the end of a gap of almost a decade. To give a comparison, then, it's like the TV Movie in Doctor Who - it's an unexpected, much-delayed return. So is Hound the most famous story because it deserves to be, as the greatest Holmes story ever - or is is simply because, at the time it was published, it was really hyped up and launched on a hungry readership eager for more. We don't actually think the TV Movie's the best story ever, but it got the best ratings for more than 15 years and was at the time the most publicised story ever.

Plus-- plus-- On a similar note, was The Final Problem pre-advertised as Holmes' last story, or was the readership shocked when they first read it to learn that Conan Doyle was (apparently) finished with Holmes.

And finally-- and finally-- Reading The Final Problem, it has that real 'season finale' feel to it. Baker Street goes up in flames, Holmes & Watson are on the run, Holmes' life is under threat... And as for the actual 'death'. It's odd, because on the one hand the story is very 'final' - on the other hand, it's beautifully done, and is left in such a way that when he does come back it doesn't seem a 'cheat'. It's like Dirty Den's first death, in that everything suggests it, but we don't actually see it. Did Conan Doyle leave himself a get-out clause (after all, if he really wanted to kill the character off it would have been the flourish of his pen to have Holmes shot dead)? Was it the suggestion of his wife, or his mother, or his publisher, that maybe it would be best not to totally slaughter the goose that laid the golden eggs?

So, full of questions and interest - but really just getting all these thoughts that have been buzzing round my head, out in the open. Regardless of all the above, I'm really enjoying the books, and there's still a LOT to go yet.

I can't be the only fan, I'm sure...

[SiHart]

I've never read a Holmes story.

I'm quietly vacating this thread now...

Si xx

[Jon Masters]

I've read a couple of biographies of ACD, and listened to the radio thing about the letters to his mother, but my memory isn't what it was and others may well correct much of what I say.

I believe the Final Problem was designed to be the end of SH - by now ACD was heartily pissed off that his ' more serious' literature (in his words) was being ignored - he saw himself as a new Sir Walter Scott, writing heroic historical fiction. I don't think it was deliberately written with a get out clause, but that rather ACD couldn't bring himself to give SH a common death by pistol etc.

Certainly the public had no idea until it was published - hence all the fuss with people wearing black armbands in mourning and I think it even got discussed in Parliament.

As for the timing of THOTB, although the book was written after The Memoirs (with the Final Problem) and before The Return I'm fairly sure the story itself is set before Holmes meets Moriarty at Reichenbach.
As for the others, I think, like DW continuity, ACD just ignored it and consequently there are some debatable issues for fans to get their teeth into (I believe the marital status of Dr Watson at any one time is almost as confusing as UNIT dating !!)

[Stuart Wallis]

My brother had them about 25 years ago

I hope Martin's recovered from them.

There's a lot of UNIT dating in the Holmes stories; Conan Doyle didn't seem to be that bothered with continuity, and if you think Who fans spend a lot of time discussing the plot holes, you should listen to Sherlockians trying to get their canon in the right order! I shan't even mention Watson's migratory war wound...

As Jon says, by the time The Final Problem was published Doyle was thoroughly sick of Holmes - there's a cartoon satirising his view that his most famous creation was a millstone round his neck. He did want to go off and write other things, and wasn't too bothered personally about how he died as long as his readership didn't feel short-changed, but ironically it's Holmes and Professor Challenger that are best remembered now, both in the public awareness stakes and critically.

The Hound was set before The Final Problem, and was written because of public demand.

I hope that answers everything.

[Captain Tancredi]

You can do a fair bit of reordering if you want to - 'The Gloria Scott' and 'The Musgrave Ritual' are Holmes before Watson, so have to come first, while 'His Last Bow' is written as the last one, with Holmes in retirement. If you read a good annotated edition, it'll point out one or two inconsistencies over the course of the canon, but unless Watson dates the story himself, the main way of placing a story are whether Holmes and Watson are living together in Baker Street and whether Watson is married or widowed.