Rate and Discuss: Father's Day

[SiHart]

The Doctor takes Rose on a voyage of family discovery which ends in tragedy in 1987.

Paul Cornell writes for Doctor Who for the first time. What do you think of this episode?

[Si Hunt]

Everyone else liked this straight away but it took time to grow on me. The central premise is great, but there are some real problems with the plot. It's not clear why the TARDIS suddenly becomes a police box shell, or why it then forms around the key. Or why Pete's car accident seems to follow him round like a sentient being. And the Reapers suddenly appearing because there's a time paradox is great, except we've had time paradoxes before and they never appeared, so it feels a bit like Paul Cornell has just decided to re-write the rules of the series for his story.

However, wear it wins out is in an amazing performance by Billie Piper, and some genuinely creepy imagary such as the Reapers devouring people and the spooky, ever present car circling Pete waiting for a second chance. It's also the biggest Weepy in Doctor Who to date, and you've a heart of stone if you don't join in.

So it's great fun, it looks brilliant, and on its own terms its superb. It's just a shame the rest of Doctor Who exists to contradict it.

Si.

[Perry Vale]

No hesitation, a 10/10 from me.

Exploring areas never seen in the show before, and yet another with exquisite direction from Joe Ahearne. Piper is on top form, and Dingwall is perfect casting as Pete. Throw in some brilliant "wow" moments with the empty Tardis & the Doctor "dying", a great supporting cast (and good turn from Corduri), and you're left with one of the most memorable DW's of all time, imo.

[J.R. Southall]

Going along with what Si said at the top. It's almost a great Doctor Who story, but it doesn't seem to quite know what it wants to be (and there's some pretty shoddy performances amongst the guest cast, too - the director was more interested in his lenses, apparently ...).

There are some amazing moments, though: the Doctor finding the Police Box empty (while perhaps not logical) is astonishing; and later, the Doctor getting eaten by one of the Reapers is completely unexpected and eye-opening, too; the long take on Shaun Dingwall as he realises what he needs to do and decides to do it is the real tear-jerking moment, I think.

I gave it a 7. It's solid, it's really good stuff. But it's not "great".

[Si Hunt]

I remain completely astonished at how many people were/are seduced by the empty police box shot, even though it's completely unexplained! Why would the TARDIS just suddenly become a police box because someone went back in time and changed history? I mean, it wasn't even a police box to start with, it was only disguised as one. Is everyone else really so comfortable with a "cool" shot even though it makes no sense whatsoever?

Si.

[Perry Vale]

Is everyone else really so comfortable with a "cool" shot even though it makes no sense whatsoever?

Whilst it is a bit vague in it's explanation (but then all timey-wimey ones are), I certainly don't see it as making no sense whatsover. Rose changes time and creates a new timeline where The Doctor & Rose are "trapped" and Pete is alive. The Tardis (interior) can only exist in one timeline, so is an empty shell in the timeline they are inhabiting.

[Rob McCow]

I thought that something had gone wrong with the TARDIS because of the way they'd mucked about with time.

[Dino]

I voted a ten. And I find myself defending Rose for being selfish!
If I was in her shoes, I'd probably do the same.
Any lesser series would have overplayed the "My Dad's dead but I can save him" angle and ruined it. But it was handled really well.
Probably my highlight from the first series.

[Larry]

Whilst it is a bit vague in it's explanation (but then all timey-wimey ones are), I certainly don't see it as making no sense whatsover. Rose changes time and creates a new timeline where The Doctor & Rose are "trapped" and Pete is alive. The Tardis (interior) can only exist in one timeline, so is an empty shell in the timeline they are inhabiting.

have to say I never had a problem understanding why the TARDIS, interior vanished although it may not have been clear to begin with The Doctor, did say that the Reapers had appeard because "time had been damaged" . So I assume that with no Time Lords, to fix things this is why the TARDIS, appears to of been destroyed.

Over all I absolutely love this one it's by far the best story of series 1 and even my sister who only started watching Doctor Who, because of Joel, thinks Fathers Day, is a good one. It's a beautifully written and it's the only Doctor Who, story in both classic and new series that really got to me emotionaly. You'd have to have a heart of stone not to feel a bit emotional at the end when Pete askes Rose,"who am I" and she replies "you're my daddy" befor he runs out of the church and basicly kills himself.

10/10

[duncan]

A solid 7 from me. Not the best but up there as one of the also rans of the series. The best moment was the Doctor being "killed" by a Reaper.

[SiHart]

I was talking about this story with my nephew yesterday. It's his favourite Doctor Who story apparently. He has great taste.

This story got me from the first time I watched it. the emotional impact of meeting Pete, who we'd heard a bit about in stories earlier in the season was great. Rose might have been selfish in saving him, but quite frankly who wouldn't do the same if they were in her position? That's why this works, despite the action being a selfish one, because we can all empathize with that of the loss of a family member to some extent.

There are lots of great bits, but two stand out for me- the Doctor having the conversation with the two people getting married and lamenting the fact that he doesn't have a life like that was wonderful, along with the moment Peter realises that he has to sacrifice himself to put everything right. Then he becomes the hero Rose was always lead to believe he was. Fantastic.

Quite possibly the best story of the season.

[Andrew Curnow]

I love it. I will admit that it's difficult to actually explain the plot, but it 'feels' like it makes sense when you first watch it (at least I found so) - it was only after the fact I wondered why the car kept appearing around the church, etc. But that's not to take away from an extraordinary Doctor Who story. Maybe for those of us who'd really taken to the NAs, a more blatantly emotional Who story wasn't a 100% surprise from Paul Cornell, but even so it really is very different from any other story to this point.

Amongst the other great moments already singled out, and as well as agreeing with all the praise heaped on Billie for this episode, I'd like to just mention Eccleston. In a lot of ways this episode is far more an episode about Rose than it is about the Doctor, and he plays it just right - never more so than at the end, where he reappears alive again behind Rose. It's not done as a big "dada, the Doctor IS ALIVE!!" moment, it's just stepping into frame and he gently says, "Go to him, quick." For whatever reason, I always find that simple moment just incredibly moving.

A real gem.

[Llordllama]

I also gave it a 7, which is odd as aside from the last two eps of the season it's the one that really struck a chord (I have father issues I suspect) and felt very adult. Especially after all that crap with the unfunny farting aliens, it was good to be reminded that you could have a real emotional heart tugging drama; meshed with time/space/life/death about someone who didn't actually matter - or rather they only really mattered to Rose.

Pete was just brilliant, and I agree with the comments above about Billie acting her socks off. If anything, was this the first Doctor-lite episode as well (since he gets nommned up midway)?

However, I've shaved points off because I rarely feel like going back to watch it again and I realise it's one that the emotional kick has faded from with repeat viewings.

That said "Go to him" still puts a tear in my eye in a lump in my throat!

[Si Hunt]

The Doctor, did say that the Reapers had appeard because "time had been damaged" . So I assume that with no Time Lords, to fix things this is why the TARDIS, appears to of been destroyed.

Not to pick, but why would the TARDIS be destroyed just because "time has been damaged"? All the people on Earth seem unscathed, so I don't know why the Doctors time ship (except the outer shell) would suddenly cease to exist. I just don't get it!

In many ways, the car chasing Pete round is more of a problem. Can anyone explain this? It's like time is suddenly "sentient" and is willing itself back onto the right track. A great idea, but it's totally inconsistent with the rest of Doctor Who, which has never in 50 years ever referred to time as "living".

Si.

[Jason Thompson]

OK, none of the events in Father's Day with regard to the efect of changing time have happened or been referred to in Doctor Who before, but then neither has the Doctor ever taken someone back in time to the exact point he had already taken them back in time to with the express intention of changing something (Rose changed nothing the first time, and the Doctor warned her that them being there and then twice made it risky). He also mentions that the Time Lords would have prevented the consequences had they been around. Perhaps this effect of doubling across his own time stream and then making a change to established history explains the horror with which the Chancellor of the Time Lords greeted the President's idea to send the Second Doctor to help the Third in The Three Doctors: crossing his own personal time stream makes Time itself vulnerable, and could make a bad situation worse.

So in summary I am not convinced it does contradict anything in the rest of Who, because it's a situation that has never actually previously arisen.

As for the episode itself, yeah, love it. The reapers are suitably scary, and the image of them in silhouette through the stained glass, scratching at the church to get in is chilling. The Doctor being eaten by one was also a big shock moment. Then there's the moment Pete puts two and two together and realises that Rose is his daughter all grown up. A real tear-jerker, that one.

[SiHart]

I'm not sure it directly contradicts anything really. The Doctor is always muttering on about time having a way of sorting things out and straightening out problems, maybe this is just the first time we've seen what he says happens happening.

[Larry]

Not to pick, but why would the TARDIS be destroyed just because "time has been damaged"? All the people on Earth seem unscathed, so I don't know why the Doctors time ship (except the outer shell) would suddenly cease to exist. I just don't get it!

In many ways, the car chasing Pete round is more of a problem. Can anyone explain this? It's like time is suddenly "sentient" and is willing itself back onto the right track. A great idea, but it's totally inconsistent with the rest of Doctor Who, which has never in 50 years ever referred to time as "living".

Si.

I think it's more of a mystery as to why the car appears at the church when Pete, was originaly killed on the estate he lived on.

[MacNimon]

I love this story, certainly it's one of the highlights of the season for me. I'm not ashamed to say that it brought a lump to my throat! Sentimental without being too schmaltzy. 9/10

[SiHart]

I think it's more of a mystery as to why the car appears at the church when Pete, was originaly killed on the estate he lived on.

I thought that was one of the consequences of Rose's changes, with time acting in a mysterious, unknwable way trying to fix things and get things back on the right track. If this episode is playing time as a sentient force then that works. If it's not, then who knows!

[debz1941]

I found this episode really emotional. It really tore on the heart strings, brilliant. Loved the story line. I thought the empty tardis was because if time was being erased,and consumed, then a time machine could not exist within the cleansing zone, i.e earth. Just a thought. Anyway, one of the few episodes where I cry everytime i watch it