Rate and Discuss 6.7: A Good Man Goes To War

[SiHart]

Well, we turned round and she was wearing an eyepatch!

Good man, going to war, shortly.

What did you think?

[Dino]

Well for a start I think Sky are *^%**!£$ for taking my Sky playback offline and insisting on a charge I've not got instantly to get it working again.
This and tomorrow will be the only time I get to see it. Just like the old days, except no other video. Ok, just like the earlier days then.
Excited!

[SiHart]

Well, er... Oh MY!

[Larry]

9/10 - did it live up to all the hype i'm not sure - the Doctor, being one of th monks was so predictable and River, being Amy's daughter, is pretty much what I expected even if the Doctor's reaction to the news seemed strange.. loved the humanised Sontaron A few unanswered questions like where did the Silurians come from and how did the female Silurian end up in 19th century London and were those Mondas/Telos Cybermen but who cares . over all an enjoyable episode and I now can't wait untill the Autumn.

[egdcltd]

Whose idea was it to put a massive gap in the middle of the series? Aaargh!

[Zbigniev Hamson]

Well that's the last time I believe any hype about a massive, earth-shattering, game-changing cliffhanger then.

[SiHart]

Well quite.

[Dirk Gently]

TOP MARKS!! I loved that one!

I never listened to any hype, I never read anything at all about this series, as I may have mentioned in another thread, and it paid off in spades.
This was fast paced until the bad guys were "defeated" & then as things were being revealed it slowed down to let the revelations sink in.

That episode totally went up my flag pole & I'm saluting it! 10/10.

[Perry Vale]

Well, that was miles better than The Long Game, The Idiot's Lantern, 42 and The Unicorn & The Wasp, but probably not quite as good as Amy's Choice.

Will probably give it a 9/10, but need to give it another watch.

[Darren]

I've been reading these posts thinking you were all just being funny because I'm on holiday and have no idea what day it is.

Luckily there are no real spoilers on here yet.

[Philipnet]

I liked it.
At the start it took a really long time before we saw Matt Smith.
I didn't like the flying aeroplanes that shouldn't fly in space .

The reveal - that River Song is Amy's daughter - well if you name your daughter Melody, that's half the game given away. And I don't care that the only water in the forest is a river.

I liked the Monks. This was first time we saw them on screen and they were suitably bad-ass.

[Philipnet]

Well that's the last time I believe any hype about a massive, earth-shattering, game-changing cliffhanger then.

Game changing - no.
Although a few things about The Impossible Astronaut make sense now (and a few more questions get raised).

[Andrew Curnow]

I'm not sure it was even a cliffhanger at all, was it, not really?

Having really struggled to work up much enthusiasm for this new season, I was pleasantly surprised to really enjoy tonight's finale. I did get just a little bit fed up waiting for the Doctor to finally appear, but he was worth the wait - once again, I'm reminded just how superb Smith is, that scene (just for one example) where he takes on Major Runaway was just superb, I find Smith's angry acting far more convincing than his snarly predecessor.

Criticisms... Well, the Silurian & Sontaran appearances did have a feel of "which costumes have we got on the shelf" about them, but that aside I really enjoyed the Sontaran nurse - indeed, I'd say he got most of the best lines of the night (particularly loved his first appearance where he was tremendously polite to the humans, even when hoping he would one day meet them and kill them).

My instinct on 'Danny Boy' popping up was to roll my eyes... but Zel, less a card-carrying fan than me, really enjoyed that, so I may just be over-thinking the notion of the Doctor summoning two fighters from the middle of world war 2 to take them across time and space to knock out a communications array on an asteroid in deep space....

All in all, yes, I really enjoyed it - there were some nice twists (the baby being a fake, the cot) and although the rumour that River was Amy's baby sounded really naff, actually in context I felt it worked very well.

Good ending... and I'm pleased we didn't get left with a real cliffhanger (like last week for example) that really left us hanging mid-story for the Summer.

[Dino]

I'm glad that spoiler rumour of them ripping of Empire Strikes Back and having the Doctor frozen in ice and taken away as Rory, River and Amy were trapped on a spacestation turned out to be a load of old toot!

[duncan]

Rory was excellent against the Cybermen, it was just so obvious that the Doctor was under one of the monk costumes and the cliffhanger was a huge disappointment considering how much was made of it by Moffat.

[Lord President]

Awesome in every way. I especially loved the revelation that we get the word for doctor from The Doctor and not the other way around! ;-)

Doctor Who will return in Let's Kill Hitler! Excellent!!!!!!!

[Martin Curnow]

Melody Pond - I'm sure I wasn't the only one to think I'd got it right, think it was a ploy to misdirect us and then feel somewhat disappointed that we had, in fact, got it right at the top of the episode.

Still, to try and work this into the rest of the season... River is in the asronaut suit and kills the Doctor (or is it ?) in 2011 - but why? - and was in the same suit over 40 years earlier with the silence in 1969?

And River says that this is the day the Doctor finds out who I am --- er, yea because you turn up and tell him. SO HE DIDN'T NEED TO!

[The456]

Gave it a 9, becoming more impressed with Matt Smiths acting every week. There are all sorts of possibilities now.......Rory can be the Dr's father in law !! but I'm thinking are we going to end up with some paradox whereby Amy herself only exists because of something the Dr and River do or can control ?!

[Anthony Williams]

Well, that was a total trainwreck...

[The456]

Shame Dorian lost his head, he could have been a good ongoing character. Splitting the series is "ok" but would have liked to have had more episodes, 16 in total.

[FlyingBeastie]

Well, that was a total trainwreck...

What's the cheese with all the holes? Cos that's what this episode was.

Apart from me being wrong on the whole "rape" thing, I can safely say "I told you so" to everyone who was arguing with me about the fact how Steven Moffat isn't as clever as he makes himself out to be and is actually just making things more complicated for the sake of making them so.

Truth is- everything is massively obvious with him.

Moment I saw the regenerating kid, I thought- it's River.

Even during that Angel two parter when I saw Amy and River next to each other I knew "Pond" and "River" weren't just coincidence.

So I think it's fair to say, given that the symbol was blatantly there on the flags, Moffat intends on bringing Omega back for the big bad reveal. Again, people will tear it down as being part of some assumption for my "agenda", so why should I even bother putting spoilers on it.

My gripes with the episode:

1. I had just came back from seeing X-Men First Class and thoroughly enjoyed every minute of it. So the fact this episode somewhat took away that high, I'm already pissed.

2. What was the point of the opening? People were complaining on the other thread of RTD spending big bucks on the whole "Galifrey Citadel" effect- wonder why they're not complaining about this opening sequence with Rory on the Cybermen ship. Why was this important? Why did the Cybers know anything about the cleric having Amy? Did they even know? Has Moffat forgotten that Cybermen aren't robots but actually cyborg beings and he has just written (yet again) that The Doctor has committed genocide for NO REASON?

3. What time does this take place? Where?

4. Yet again, there's been no real tone or stakes set for River being in the Stormcage. Didn't she kill someone? Why can she freely go out and about wherever she pleases? Why does she even bother going back? ::Insert that horrible move Alex Kingston does where she gets behind the cage to say that dramatic line for obvious dramatic purposes::

5. Wasn't Avery's son dying of the funny syphillus? Why is he even brought along? Were the other pirates supposed to be there too? Could the actors not come out due to a scheduling conflict?

6. Actually, you know who would've helped? That Siren chick- I mean, headless monks? She totes could've wiped them out thinking they were "sick" in no time.

7. "The Doctor stopped the war and no blood was shed" (not the actual line, but something like it) Uhm, hello? Cybermen fleet = decimated. Protoblood was certainly shed (I think?).

8. Yet again we have an episode where Moffat shoehorns a bunch of familiar aliens to come together- only this time they help The Doctor! ::LAME::

9. What happened for the 45 minutes this episode ran? I'm literally trying to recall and it's just like a vacuum. I mean, that speech scene feels like it went on for 20 minutes.

10. Everyone in the cleric army mumbled all their scenes- I think there was a gay couple implied but I'm not sure. I guess it was Moffat's attempt to actually humanise these people... didn't work.

11. Wasn't that chick in Prince of Persia? I'm also not sure why she was in this episode. One of my brother's friends half expected her to regenerate into Alex Kingston... but she didn't...

12. So who's the big bad again? Why did the TARDIS explode at the end of "Pandorica Opens"? Why hasn't The Doctor been concerned with this or who sent him the letter in IA?

13. I'd talk about the Silence, but I know someone's just gonna tell me to wait for the latter half of the season.

14. Again- as I've mentioned before- Moffat makes things more complicated to make them more complicated- HOW HARD IS IT TO STEAL A BABY FROM A PREGNANT WOMAN??? I mean, REALLY??

Why go through the effort? Why be so obvious about it?

Y'know, had The Ponds stayed behind on Earth after the Xmas episode and had the baby, they would've been pretty susceptible to just about anyone. So why didn't they just snatch the kid then?

In fact, they could've gotten away with planting a ganger baby and the Ponds would've never known the difference. The Doctor certainly wouldn't know what was up.

I mean, if you're so intent on getting back at The Doctor, don't you think the element of "SURPRISE" would be the best tactic with which to carry out your plan?

Cos they even say in the episode the whole "Timelord" gene and conception happened on the Ponds wedding night. And Amy was abducted even before America...

Soo... see what I mean about Moffat wasting everyone's time?

15. When did The Doctor write on the crib?

16. Anyone else getting a creepy pedo vibe now about the whole Doctor/River thing? I mean, would anyone else bone someone they carried in their hand as a baby?

17. Why was the blue guy there? In fact, why did the eye patch woman and the probation worker (Misfits) visit him? What was the point of that scene motivationally speaking?


At this point I'm just gonna stop cos, frankly, I'm tired and am gonna troll Tumblr for X-Men posts. I don't want to go to bed annoyed. Cos at this point I'm not angry, just slightly disgusted and slightly annoyed. Cos if I was angry or had any strong revulsion, that would imply I had hope for this episode or was let down somehow.

And I wasn't. Cos at this point, I know what Moffat is and the extent of his abilities. And at this point, I understand what Alex meant about not feeling so strongly cos he's not so ultimately invested in the series. Cos I've now taken on that same attitude, because my expectations for anything Moffat takes a part in are below the floor.

2*/10

*Great effects, let's face it.

[Awesome Wells]

Anyone else getting a creepy pedo vibe now about the whole Doctor/River thing? I mean, would anyone else bone someone they carried in their hand as a baby?

This is ridiculous. Yes, I think it would be a bit creepy for a HUMAN BEING to cop off with someone they'd known as a baby - not illegal provided it happened when the latter was suitably of age, but yes, it's a bit murky in terms of morals - but the Doctor is a 900 year old time traveller. Theoretically he could go back and meet anyone he pulls as a baby; and similarly, he could meet somebody as a baby and then get off with them in their relative future.

But most of all, I don't get a "creepy pedo vibe" because:

1. River is an adult
2. An adult time traveller
3. An adult Time Lordy time traveller
4. When the Doctor snogged her, he had no idea she was Melody Pond
5. What does that matter, anyway? Everyone was a baby once
6. There's been no "boning"
7. Zzzzzzzzz....
8. I hate lists
9. Made my point ages ago. Just filling in space now with silly items for the sake of it
10. Irony

[Awesome Wells]

For the record, I loved the first 45 minutes - possibly the greatest heights Doctor Who has ever scaled in a searing whirl of wonderful comic book images - but the ending was a huge disappointment. River was unusually rubbish, spouting a load of pompous cack in a monotone ("Oh my love..." droned the robotic am-dram ham) and then the dreadful truth became clear: the too-obvious answer was the right answer and it just felt... numbing and wrong, somehow. Is there more to it? Is River fibbing to reassure Amy and Rory about their baby's safety? I hope so but doubt it.

The Doctor dashing off was a bit undramatic, too. In fact, I wish they'd bumped another episode from the second half of the series to the first and had the split after The Almost People. Would've worked far better and negated the negative impact (hey - positivity!) of the River reveal.

So, big score for most of it, crap score for the end = hmmmm.

[Andrew Curnow]

I think the only thing that didn't quite ring true with me, was arguably the main thrust of the episode - so when River berates the Doctor at the end, I can't say I'm really convinced the Doctor has been so bad that he's created himself a reputation as a great warrior. In fact, last night's episode was about the only time I can ever think of him really putting together an army of any sort - so is it really fair for him to be held accountable for galactic gossip & exaggeration?

Oh that, and the question which sort of hung over the episode for me... why didn't he just arrive in the TARDIS, get in, get Amy, get out. I didn't see a scenario that required an army more than (m)any other past situations.

But this week I'm happy to put my mental niggles aside, because I enjoyed it a great deal - and just to come back to Smith, as well as the angry scene, I thought he was superb playing the scene where Lorna dies.

[Perry Vale]

Why did the Cybers know anything about the cleric having Amy? Did they even know?

Rory "The 12th Cyber Legion monitors this entire quadrant. You hear everything."

What time does this take place? Where?

3 weeks to a month after last week's cliffhanger. At Demon's Run