Thread: Richard III
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4th Feb 2013, 10:28 AM #1
Richard III
It's him!
Why build an engine when you have a perfectly good whale?
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4th Feb 2013, 10:32 AM #2
The live results are being announced right now...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21319148
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4th Feb 2013, 10:33 AM #3
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4th Feb 2013, 10:56 AM #4
They shut the live feed on the link I posted after the "final verdict" which is a shame as would've been good to hear from the representative of the Richard III society....
Anyway the DNA examination proves...
It really is Richard III beyond all reasonable doubt.
The skeleton will be reburied at Leicester Cathedral.
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4th Feb 2013, 10:58 AM #5
It's fascinating.
Why build an engine when you have a perfectly good whale?
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4th Feb 2013, 11:25 AM #6
Blimey! It's a quite astonishing find and some brilliant work from the archaeologists too
I've just got my handcuffs and my truncheon and that's enough.
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4th Feb 2013, 11:50 AM #7
Interesting stuff indeed.
If you want to see Sir Robert Burgess et al talking about this then BBCi Player the news channel & go back to 10am.
Of course this'll you'll only be able to do this until 12.
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4th Feb 2013, 3:09 PM #8
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5th Feb 2013, 7:41 AM #9
Comments between my sister and I have included:
"A carpark, a carpark, my Kingdom for a carpark!"
and
"Now is the winter of our disinterment".Assume you're going to Win
Always have an Edge
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5th Feb 2013, 11:13 PM #10
Am I the only one who thinks that the 'reconstructed' face looks like Matthew MacFadyen from Spooks?
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6th Feb 2013, 6:34 AM #11
I think it's really interesting. From what I've been reading recently, this is possibly a perfect example of how we ever only hear the version of history that the winning side allow us to hear, isn't it? For all that he's portrayed as a bit of a tyrant and a murderer, this is obviously what the victorious Henry VII wanted people to hear because Richard had a stronger claim to the throne than Richard did. I don't mean that he wasn't a murderer or anything, but his successor would obviously play down his good points (if any - but apparently a lot of the good stuff in our society today which protects the common man stems from his reign) and exagerate his bad ones just to get the people on his side, wouldn't he? It's what I'd do if I were in his shoes! And some people even reckon that Shakespeare was asked/instructed by the Tudors to do a bit of a hatchet job on him on his famous play, thus cementing his place in history as a tyrant.
It's a fascinating story though, whatever is true. A great find.
All they need to do now is find and identify the body of King Harold, which has been missing since the Battle of Hastings in 1066...
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6th Feb 2013, 8:14 AM #12
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6th Feb 2013, 9:33 AM #13
Well his tombstone can be visited at Waltham Abbey just down the road from me but it would be interesting to potentially have a sensitive investigation to discover if there are any actual remains there.
Notably through a series of disastrous happenings most of William the Conqueror's bones have been destroyed over the centuries. I believe there is one left on display at whichever abbey it is in Normandy that he was originally buried at.
Also now that we have a definitive DNA sample for Richard III, I'd really like the bones buried in an urn at Westminster Abbey which may, or may not, be those of his murdered nephews to be properly carbon-dated and DNA tested. Sadly it's very unlikely that the Dean and Chapter of the Abbey will grant permission for this.
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6th Feb 2013, 3:18 PM #14
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Henry had no legal claim to the throne as it happens; whilst he was related to the royal family of the day, he was in a branch of the Lancastrians that Richard II barred from the throne before the start of the Wars of the Roses on the grounds of illegitimacy. The Lancastrians backed him because a) they'd run out of legal heirs themselves; and b) he was related to Henry V's widow - a claim that was dubious to the point of effective illegitimacy as well. In the end, he made his claim by "right of conquest" ie. I won so there!, which he "strengthened" by marrying Richard's neice - ergo, Richard is Henry VIII's great uncle.
And as for Shakespeare, he has a bit of a reputation for using his plays to lick certain bodily orifices of whoever was on the throne at the time; there's no evidence that Macbeth even knew any witches, for instance, but Will put them in his play and made them wicked old crones because James I was all for burning them in real life.
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6th Feb 2013, 3:35 PM #15
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My brother was born in Waltham Abbey as it happens. The Abbey of Waltham Holy Cross was built on Harold's orders in 1060. There appears to be no definitive evidence that he is still there, but don't tell anyone as the local tourist industry relies on his presence.
William I was buried at Abbey-aux-Hommes in Caen. We shan't go into his funeral, it was very Horrible Histories...
The bodies in Westminster Abbey Richard's referring to may or may not be the Princes in the Tower, one of whom was actually King Edward V rather than a prince. Just after the restoration, the skeletons of two boys were found bricked up behind the outer wall of the White Tower in the Tower of London. Charles II requested them interred at Westminster in case it was them.
Can I stop being Royal Wikipedia please...?
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6th Feb 2013, 5:17 PM #16Originally Posted by MacNimon
Richard, in actuality, was known during his reign as a "Good Lord" who punished "the oppressors of the commons". He was known for his pursuit of legal fairness in England.
Certainly, Shakespeare's portrayal of him was unfair, but he was not the originator of Richard's bad reputation.
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8th Feb 2013, 12:16 AM #17
Blackadder:- "Baldrick! Are you telling me your cunning plan is to hide him under a car park!?"
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8th Feb 2013, 2:53 PM #18
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"It worked for Lord Lucan, Mr. B! Only it was that or hide in a lasagne like Shergar did."
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11th Feb 2013, 9:39 PM #19
I once came across a Richard III in a car park and I never got on the news.
For every fail, there is an equal and opposite win.
...Oh, who am I kidding?
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11th Feb 2013, 10:05 PM #20
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12th Feb 2013, 3:02 PM #21
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It wasn't a Richard III, it was a wife of Henry VIII, and they're so common they come in sixes. That's why you're not on the telly!
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28th May 2013, 5:15 PM #22Originally Posted by natureworldnewsAssume you're going to Win
Always have an Edge
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29th May 2013, 3:11 PM #23
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"The radiocarbon dates, evidence on the male skeleton of severe scoliosis, trauma consistent with injuries in battle and potential peri-mortem 'humiliation injuries', combined with the mtDNA match with two independent, well-verified matrilineal descendants all point clearly to the identification of this individual as King Richard III,” the researchers said in a statement. “Indeed, it is difficult to explain the combined evidence as anyone else.”
perimortem - at or around the time of death.
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29th May 2013, 10:07 PM #24
Thanks for that, Stuart. I'd be lost with out you.
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30th May 2013, 2:40 PM #25
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My sense of direction, you'd be untraceable with me!
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