Glory Glory UKIP Party

[Wayne]

I voted Green in the Euro elections, but if I was anti-Europe, I think I'd vote http://www.no2eu.com/.

[Perry Vale]

I voted Green, too, after a lifetime of voting Labour.

I accept Mike's points, although fail to see any evidence that voting UKIP will bring about any of the changes needed, that Mike mentions. They're not a real party, IMO, they are simply a tool being used by the establishment (mostly senior Tories, I'd imagine) to influence voting patterns.

I'm now firmly of the belief that we, as a poeple, should kick the whole bunch of LibLabCons out of Westminster. All three are corrupt institutions, having been left to fester such odious excuses for human beings for at least a 100 years. Westminster paedophile rings, expenses, being in the pocket of people like Murdoch and Prime Ministers falling over themselves to get Jimmy Saville a knighthood. It's worse than a cesspool.

Every government blames the one prior, getting them 'off the hook', but both sides continue to destroy everything great that this country has built (the NHS, Post Office). The 'cost of living' crisis and 'wealth gap' aren't something new, created over the last few years by any one single government, you can trace it back for FORTY years, at least.

The recent history of British Democracy is summed up best by that man Einstein, when he said “The Definition of Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results”.

[Mike Saville]

All three are corrupt institutions, having been left to fester such odious excuses for human beings for at least a 100 years. Westminster paedophile rings, expenses, being in the pocket of people like Murdoch and Prime Ministers falling over themselves to get Jimmy Saville a knighthood.

Savile. Jimmy Savile.
On behalf of the Nominally Distanced Party.

[Perry Vale]

It took a few moments for the penny to drop there....

[Mike Saville]

With my lifestyle I have enough judgmental fingers pointing at me.
They need no further ammo.

[dalekkiller]

If you want to know just how vile and nasty UKIP can get then look no further

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...ics?CMP=twt_gu

[Mike Saville]

OOOh. A political party exploiting a news story for political gain. That's nasty. A good job none of the other parties would ever do such a thing, isn't it?

Now, come on, I'm sorry, but this is the norm. I'm no lover or supporter of Farage, but some of what he says seems to be true based on testimonials we've heard from the select committee so far. New Labour were scared to rock the boat, and were not prepared to take action over child abuse- certainly in Rochdale- because they didn't want to be accused of being racist (or whatever language they used). If the other main parties dealt with matters like race, immigration and Europe openly, without being terrified of getting the Enoch Powell tag (or calling anyone a racist or a xenophobe who doesn't agree with their view), then people like Farage wouldn't have spacesuch a huge following.

People are fed up with the big three. The LibDems had the opportunity to take that ground but instead have chosen to make themselves unelectable for the next generation. Farage, like all politcal leaders, has maneuvered himself well to at least claim to represent the disenfranchised. That's his job. The shame isn't on Farage for doing his job, it's on Clegg, the Millibands, Cameron, Blair, Brown and all those others that made Farage's job that much easier.

[SiHart]

Farage has also done a Paddy Power ad for the Ryder Cup. He's not one to let any publicity pass him by.

[Perry Vale]

If UKIP ever do get any power in Westminster, they will then start to defect and reincorporate into the Tory party. They are the same party, always have been.

Nigel Farage earns the Rupert Murdoch seal of approval in impromptu Manhattan meeting

[Wayne]

Perry's spot-on. UKIP are merely the euro-sceptic wing of the Tory party. Anyone who thinks they represent ordinary working people are idiots.
Trouble is, New Labour barely represent them either...

[dalekkiller]

OOOh. A political party exploiting a news story for political gain. That's nasty. A good job none of the other parties would ever do such a thing, isn't it?

Now, come on, I'm sorry, but this is the norm. I'm no lover or supporter of Farage, but some of what he says seems to be true based on testimonials we've heard from the select committee so far. New Labour were scared to rock the boat, and were not prepared to take action over child abuse- certainly in Rochdale- because they didn't want to be accused of being racist (or whatever language they used). If the other main parties dealt with matters like race, immigration and Europe openly, without being terrified of getting the Enoch Powell tag (or calling anyone a racist or a xenophobe who doesn't agree with their view), then people like Farage wouldn't have spacesuch a huge following.

People are fed up with the big three. The LibDems had the opportunity to take that ground but instead have chosen to make themselves unelectable for the next generation. Farage, like all politcal leaders, has maneuvered himself well to at least claim to represent the disenfranchised. That's his job. The shame isn't on Farage for doing his job, it's on Clegg, the Millibands, Cameron, Blair, Brown and all those others that made Farage's job that much easier.

The fact that a father of one the abused girls has complained speaks volumes. UKIP don't give a damn about these girls there just using to them whip up hatred against muslims. This wasn't just UKIP though the right-wing press were in on it too. The same right-wing press that spreads so much misinformation about Europe and immigration to such a degree that people are so utterly misinformed about it.

http://zelo-street.blogspot.co.uk/20...hypocrisy.html

[Mike Saville]

People are utterly misinformed by both sides of the debate. Because politicians are in general scared to enter into an actual debate about it. Those that do (I'm talking to you, Mr Clegg) are so out of their depth that they'd have been better off not taking part.

Can I just get rid of the 'right wing press' bollocks though. That's what's causing the accusation of politicians not listening. Europe, pro or anti- is neither left or right wing. I'm probably one of the most eurosceptical on here, and I'm very left of centre. I'm not exactly Scargill, but it's a generation since I was represented by the Labour Party too. The notion that Tory Grandees and double-barelled inbreds are the only ones who want out of Europe, or we're all misinformed little Englanders boils my piss to be frank.

Europe is not a left versus right issue, and while the three parties continue in that belief, Farage is harvesting all the disenfranchised and unlistened to people out there.

[dalekkiller]

The right-wing press's lies about Europe are a problem Mike. The problem being this the public are misinformed about Europe by a section of the media (There are numerous examples of this) from bendy bananas to the EU wanting to infterfere with British coffee pots. This in turn means that people expect politicians to respond in turn to this misinformation. So when politicians say the opposite there accused of not listening. On another forum remembered holidaying in Belgium and seeing guides to the Maastricht treaty in English, French and Flemish telling people clearly and rationally what the treaty was about. His dad remarked to him how they wouldn't get published here because too many people who wanted to promote the idea that the EU was up to something and only politicians and more importantly jounros could intempret this.

[Dino]

From a friend of mine on Facebook:

The BBC web site reports the following UKIP pledge "UKIP to promise income tax cuts - UK Independence Party leader Nigel Farage will propose cutting income tax from 40p to 35p for people earning up to £55,000 at the party's conference later."

This is misleading, and this is why I'm posting this FACTUAL repost.
I have worked for over 26 years as Tax Manager for a firm of Chartered Accountants, and previously worked for what was the Inland Revenue.

The tax reduction quoted will NOT be for people "earning up to £55,000", it will be for people whose taxable earnings exceed the current higher rate threshhold of £31,865. And for the avoidance of doubt that's AFTER personal allowances of (currently) £10,000 for anyone born after 6th April 1948. So the tax cut that's proposed is only of relevance if you earn over £41,865 (£31,865 + £10,000). Below that amount there will be no reduction in tax whatsoever on your earnings.

Similarly the new proposed rate is stated to end at "£55,000". Once more this is taxable income, ie AFTER personal allowances. So the actual total income would be £65,000 before the new 35% limit is reached.
And for the avoidance of further doubt, the reduction in tax isn't limited to those who earn up to the £65,000 threshhold as described above.

Anyone who earns over £41,865 will see a reduction, and everyone who earns over £65,000 will pay 5% less income tax on £21,135 of their earnings than they do now.
Good news if you receive a multi million pound bonus in the banking sector or you sit on the board of a utility company. No use at all if you're a nurse, a teacher, a social worker etc.

If you read this and thought "goody - I'm paying too much tax", look at the figures and work out who really benefits. If it's you and you'll vote UKIP because you'll be "better off", then so be it. But don't bother about the stuff regarding nurses and social workers. You wouldn't give a **** anyway.

[Mike Saville]

The right-wing press's lies about Europe are a problem Mike. The problem being this the public are misinformed about Europe by a section of the media (There are numerous examples of this) from bendy bananas to the EU wanting to infterfere with British coffee pots. This in turn means that people expect politicians to respond in turn to this misinformation. So when politicians say the opposite there accused of not listening. On another forum remembered holidaying in Belgium and seeing guides to the Maastricht treaty in English, French and Flemish telling people clearly and rationally what the treaty was about. His dad remarked to him how they wouldn't get published here because too many people who wanted to promote the idea that the EU was up to something and only politicians and more importantly jounros could intempret this.

I understand how the press works better than most dk. I got my degree in Media Communications 26 years ago, and a number of post grad qualifications since. I also recently helped coach my son through his Politics degree (yes guys, those of you who met him all those years ago, young Baldrick is now a graduate), and he got to speak at the European Parliament, so I am more versed in the political machinations than most I imagine.

But for every right wing press Euro lunacy statement, there are very legitimate concerns that are being disregarded. When Maastricht was rejected, it was just fudged a little, renamed, and then mostly implemented with barely any consultation anyway, so it wouldn't make much difference how many languages it was printed in. But Maastricht was freely available in English for free. I know, I just walked into my library and collected a copy free of charge There was a stack like Argos catalogues. Whenever anyone speaks out against it they're branded idiots or scaremongers. Whenever anyone calls for a referendum, we're told in coded language that we're not intelligent enough to make an informed decision, and frankly I'm absolutely fed up of it.

Are we saying now we don't need democracy or anything resembling it? You should only get a vote if you have an IQ of 110% or above? Or maybe a meritocracy, or you only get a vote if you are earning more than 20,000 or if you own your own home? Maybe we should withdraw the vote from women, blacks and the unemployed?

The onus on politicians is to get the message out there. To get it across to the people in a way that they can understand. Maybe outsource it that information gathering to independent think tanks not affiliated to any party's agenda, as a large percentage of people no longer trust the politicians or the political process.

[Perry Vale]

Former Tory donors bankrolling UKIP to tune of £2.25MILLION as it is 'real Conservative Party'

Dozens of former Tory donors have stumped up £2.25million to bankroll Nigel Farage’s UKIP.

Almost £9 in every £10 the party receives comes from ex-Conservative backers, funding figures show.

And more than one in four of UKIP’s 2015 general election candidates have been involved previously with the Tories.

...

UKIP have tried to pose as the party of the poor to win votes in Labour heartlands.

With Labour pointing out that 24 former Tory donors have bankrolled UKIP, shadow Cabinet minister Michael Dugher said: “The truth is they’re more Tory than the Tories.

“UKIP is a party of Tory money, Tory politicians and Tory policies."

[Rob McCow]

More Conservatives betray their party to go and join UKIP.

The parallels between Harold Saxon and Nigel Farage are getting hard to ignore!

[Philipnet]

Is he going to take one in the eye then?

--

I'm actually thinking of King Harold http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harold_Godwinson who was an Anglo-Saxon king